Comments on: Guardian 24221/Pasquale — hard not easy http://www.fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/ Never knowingly undersolved. Sun, 19 May 2013 00:34:45 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.5.1 By: Pasquale http://www.fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6611 Pasquale Wed, 31 Oct 2007 20:51:19 +0000 http://fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6611 Well — thanks Mr G!

]]> By: Alan G http://www.fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6595 Alan G Wed, 31 Oct 2007 18:01:26 +0000 http://fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6595 I only buy the Guardian occasionally, and only for the crossword. I must say I enjoy the diversity of all the setters. This one took me nearly two days (what are you laughing at?) and I don’t buy another Guardian til I’ve managed to complete the one I’ve got. Pasquale, I liked this one immensely. I’m a compiler myself, so I know about all the hard work that goes into it. I learnt a lot of new words today, which surely is what solving crosswords is all about, isn’t it?

]]> By: Pasquale http://www.fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6552 Pasquale Wed, 31 Oct 2007 06:22:37 +0000 http://fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6552 I’m glad you enjoyed the puzzle, Geoff. As a matter of fact all the words I used are in all the desktop dictionaries (not just Chambers words and not obscure words for senior OED editors, of whom I was never one – but I guess you are talking about other more extreme puzzles, not this one?). If working out a cryptic clue leads one to a new word, that’s all to the good (how much we all learnt from crosswords when younger, eh?) — besides which anyone like myself setting a few thousand puzzles over a lifetime will want some freedom to explore new words and not dish up the same familiar old stuff clued in the same old way — and I see The Guardian as a good medium for that. I was particularly pleased to discover the Camilla/Camarilla idea, and rather hoped that this would bring a smile at least. I like your definition of a good clue, and while I don’t generally play for laughs, if the opportunity for a good joke occurs naturally (and it isn’t prep-school toilet stuff) I’ll seize it. I am not into sneery comments about Ximenean fundamentalism (though I’m sure YOUR comments weren’t sneery), but to my mind my question mark was necessary for the reason I have already given – nothing subtle, just that if you give an exmaple of the definition you add a ‘maybe’ or something equivalent. And, yes, 16D IS a clue, Muck — a weak cryptic definiton if you care to judge it that way but a perfectly valid clue nevertheless. Time to move on!

]]> By: Geoff http://www.fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6544 Geoff Wed, 31 Oct 2007 00:39:57 +0000 http://fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6544 Hi Pasquale (Don),

Sorry if I seemed to be damning your work with faint praise – I thought it was very good indeed, a bit tricky but not too difficult, and I much enjoyed solving it. Personally, I enjoy crosswords with a sprinkling of unusual words, some of which I feel smug about knowing, some of which I have to rush to the dictionary (generally Chambers) to confirm or discover. However, crosswords composed almost entirely of words (or obscure meanings) known only to senior editors of the OED leave me cold.
A ‘good’ clue for me is one which not only serves its purpose dutifully (ie is not a ‘bad’ clue), but also has an entirely plausible, though misleading, surface reading and makes me smile, laugh and/or marvel at the ingenuity of the setter.
As for the subtle meaning of the question mark in 16dn – a fundamentalist Ximenean would never ever need to use one, so if one appears in a Guardian crossword it could mean absolutely anything. That’s fine by me!

]]> By: muck http://www.fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6537 muck Tue, 30 Oct 2007 18:48:22 +0000 http://fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6537 I found the paper version, without the on-line errors which have become all too frequent, hard enough. I thought some of the clues I didn’t get were a liitle unfair.

27ac: Camarilla. Not a word I knew, but it is in Chambers.

21dn: Lorica. Very difficult clue, though it does work.

19ac: Ylang-Ylang. I trawled through Chambers, but only with vowels between Y and A.

16dn: Au Gratin. Sorry, not a clue.

]]> By: Pasquale http://www.fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6530 Pasquale Tue, 30 Oct 2007 14:12:28 +0000 http://fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6530 Thanks both – that’s a relief. The mere possibility of cheese is indicated by the question mark in the clue, by the way

]]> By: Geoff http://www.fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6525 Geoff Tue, 30 Oct 2007 13:23:47 +0000 http://fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6525 Some tough words here! I knew HEPTANE (saturated hydrocarbon in the same series as the more familiar propane, butane and octane) and EFFERENT, but had to check CAMARILLA and LORICA after I had worked out a possible solution from the cryptic part.

18dn: ‘Sneer at’ (BELITTLE) = ‘priest’ (ELI) ‘in conflict’ (BATTLE) without the A – which is ‘answer’ (as in Q&A)

21dn: ‘unduly ornate lacking edges’ is (F)LORI(D); ‘around’ is CA (ie circa – about or approximately)

Cosmo Lang was Archbishop of Canterbury in the mid 20th century and Camilla is indeed Duchess of Cornwall. Incidentally, serving sometning ‘au gratin’ (16dn) does not strictly require cheese – it just implies ‘cooked in a shallow dish and browned on the top’, but Pasquale’s implied meaning is current among the less culinary pedantic, and makes for a good clue – of which there were quite a few in this puzzle.

]]> By: Judy Bentley http://www.fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6522 Judy Bentley Tue, 30 Oct 2007 13:09:53 +0000 http://fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6522 Hi Pasquale
I saw the comment ‘had not easy’ and thought, blimey, if it was hard for him it will be impossible for me. I tried it anyway, having glimpsed only IBUPROFEN as a solution. I found it very accessible. But to have to contend with all those errors on the on-line version – well, no thank you.

]]> By: Pasquale http://www.fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6508 Pasquale Tue, 30 Oct 2007 09:23:51 +0000 http://fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6508 I think (fingers crossed) it’s all OK now, so I look forward to feedback from those solvers who didn’t ahve to run an obstacle course!

]]> By: Pasquale http://www.fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6505 Pasquale Tue, 30 Oct 2007 06:36:52 +0000 http://fifteensquared.net/2007/10/30/guardian-24221pasquale-hard-not-easy/#comment-6505 It’s worse than I thought. Down clues knock back. Then the last one should read Bird box attached to line. No wonder Ilan had trouble!

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