Comments on: Financial Times 13,379 / Falcon

By: Sil van den Hoek

Sil van den Hoek — Sat, 08 May 2010 18:14:44 +0000

Yes, interesting question [and nice to know as I do some occasional clueing myself] – maybe, someone will jump on board.

By: shuchi

shuchi — Sat, 08 May 2010 13:20:13 +0000

I guess we agree.

…in a Down clue BA’s possible as well: the (Across) meaning of ‘on’ being ‘attached to the end of’, does work too.

Logically yes, but I can’t recall a Down clue in which “A on B” meant anything other than AB. I’ll be interested to know if BA for “A on B” is allowed by crossword editors in Down clues, or as with Across clues, has convention led to a single meaning only.

By: Sil van den Hoek

Sil van den Hoek — Sat, 08 May 2010 12:12:40 +0000

Hi Shuchi, if you’re still there.

I’ve read Anax’ post in the link you gave in #7.
It’s mainly about Across clues, in which “A on B” has to be BA (and not AB) – which is exactly what I said in #4.
[Anax didn't really agree with this convention (which I can understand), but he had to].

Rishi’s post on that same site mentions the fact that in a Down clue “A on B” is usually AB – again, I agree.

Indeed, it’s also exactly what you said in the preamble.

My point is, that in a Down clue BA’s possible as well: the (Across) meaning of ‘on’ being ‘attached to the end of’, does work too.
[both Rishi and Anax didn't say anything about that, as they were mainly discussing Across clues]

Well, anyway, we agree, don’t we?

By: shuchi

shuchi — Sat, 08 May 2010 06:00:41 +0000

Thanks for all your comments. @Eileen: That looks good and is possibly what the setter intended. I'll add a note on 1ac to point to your comment. @Rishi: Fixed, thanks. @scarpia: Thank you, I had liked the wordplay and so it had stuck. If only my memory worked equally well at remembering where I put those bills and receipts. @Sil van den Hoek: Till some time ago I thought that in Down clues, "A on B" must be AB but in Across, "A on B" could be AB or BA. Recently came across this discussion on UKPuzzle.com that talks about the accepted convention.

By: Sil van den Hoek

Sil van den Hoek — Fri, 07 May 2010 21:12:11 +0000

For those who were interested in the the “A on B” discussion (so far nobody): in #4 line 5 should (of course) read “A on B = AB (Down) can be explained as: A put on top of B”.

Even so, nice friendly crossword.
BTW, we saw CORKSCREW very recently in a Mudd (FT 13,362 – 17 Apr): “Opener for Irish team?”.

By: scarpia

scarpia — Fri, 07 May 2010 18:21:04 +0000

Thanks Shuchi,as you say nothing too taxing and and even an opera reference!
I marvel at your memory,knowing that 23 across was a repeat of an Everyman clue – from about 3 months ago!

By: Sil van den Hoek

Sil van den Hoek — Fri, 07 May 2010 16:01:46 +0000

Thanks Shuchi.
You say: ” Note that in Across clues, A on B = BA, while in Down clues, A on B = AB”.
Is that completely watertight?
A on B = BA (Across) must be read as: A attached to B.
A on B = AB (Down) can be explained as: A put on top of A.
The Down-explanation can’t be used for an Across clue, but the Across explanation may also be used for a Down clue, I guess?
Therefore, for me it can work both ways in a Down clue, but not in an Across one.

BTW, I went wrong in 26ac/19d, because I had ACCORDEON (which is the spelling in my native country) and I can even justify it: ACCORD + EON (one playing, being the anagrind).

By: Rishi

Rishi — Fri, 07 May 2010 12:47:17 +0000

Thanks for fixing it, Shuchi.

By: Rishi

Rishi — Fri, 07 May 2010 10:43:45 +0000

Thanks for the blog, Shuchi.

In 22d, you have a typo. The word within brackets following PLAID must be ‘tartan’.

By: Eileen

Eileen — Fri, 07 May 2010 10:14:16 +0000

Thanks for the blog, Shuchi.

As you say, nothing too taxing but some nice surfaces and wordplay.

I read 1ac as C[lubs] + OVERCHARGE ['do'].