Comments on: Independent 8188/Phi

By: eimi

eimi — Sat, 12 Jan 2013 18:01:25 +0000

There are some rules, but my take on ON is that it can mean either before or after in an Across clue, but can only mean before in a Down.

By: Paul B

Paul B — Sat, 12 Jan 2013 01:42:26 +0000

Btw, second para needs ‘since they are only ever written from left to right’. Sorry — too much Guinness this eve.

By: Paul B

Paul B — Sat, 12 Jan 2013 01:39:30 +0000

It’s basic stuff according to crosswording convention: in across clues ON means ‘coming afterwards’, whereas in down clues it means ‘going on top of’ (i.e. the reverse). Simples. Ish. But some papers, while aware of such things, do not require their compilers to observe them.

A good friend of mine thinks that clues, whether across or down, since they are only ever written from right to left, can thus only ever require right-to-left reversal indicators (or, indeed, y ON x = xy positional indication), and he has a point. For myself, at the moment (and for the past few years), I (have) prefer(red) grid-specific clues that acknowledge acrossness and downness.

By: allan_c

allan_c — Sat, 12 Jan 2013 00:11:48 +0000

Harder than your average Phi; several unfamiliar or even unknown words, but eventually gettable.

And as an irrelevant aside to the ‘on’ debate, there’s no such place as Burton-on-Trent (with or without hyphens); it’s Burton upon Trent. Network Rail and others please note.

By: Bertandjoyce

Bertandjoyce — Fri, 11 Jan 2013 23:22:04 +0000

Thanks Phi, how do you manage to construct puzzles with so few black squares? It did mean that some of the answers ended up being a little obscure but they were all clearly clued. Anyway, one of the reasons for completing crosswords is the fun of learning new words that may crop in later puzzles! As with Eileen yesterday putting us straight with ‘my bad’.

Thanks John fot the blog.

By: Raich

Raich — Fri, 11 Jan 2013 22:26:34 +0000

Brian Greer’s book “How to do the Times Crossword” (2001) says (p 51) that it is a Times convention that “on” in an across clue means following rather than preceding when used to indicate the juxtaposition of parts of the answer, as in “Fastening that comes undone is a problem on undergarment” (SLIPKNOT) Maybe that is what you are thinking of, John.

By: John

John — Fri, 11 Jan 2013 22:01:21 +0000

I personally have absolutely no objection to A on B for AB in an across clue. It makes perfectly good sense, so far as I can see. It’s just that I thought we were once told that the Indy didn’t do this.

Yes of course it’s tr{i}al. Thanks NeilW — will amend the blog.

By: Kathryn's Dad

Kathryn's Dad — Fri, 11 Jan 2013 17:41:12 +0000

Thanks, John.

Enjoyed this one – a couple of unfamiliar words, but easy enough to have a stab at once you’d got some crossing letters. And cheers, Phi, for Captain Pugwash – I’ve had that bloody hornpipe going through my head all day …

We’ve had this ‘on’ in across clues debate before, I’m sure. I always remember a comment from Anax (I think) who said to think of it as something like Burton-on-Trent. Doesn’t mean Burton is actually ON the River Trent in the sense of on top of it; just next to it. Anyway, it’s always worked for me since then.

Good weekend to everyone.

By: flashling

flashling — Fri, 11 Jan 2013 16:28:07 +0000

Quiet again today, not convinced the Indy has rules as such John, bit tougher for me than Phi usually is.

By: NeilW

NeilW — Fri, 11 Jan 2013 12:11:27 +0000

Thanks, John.

I read TRA-LA as “One failing test” TR(i)AL on A

Yesterday Anax gave us “my bad” as modern slang for “oops”: today Phi gives us MEH for an “expression of indifference” (or, more often, disdain.) For my sins, I subscribe to a few Twitter accounts and see both all the time.