Guardian Prize 26,687 by Qaos

by

A prize puzzle with a literary theme from Qaos this week.

The special instructions read: Six solutions are characters, not further defined, from 18’s work about 5 down, 21 across.  In fact, unless I’ve missed something, 5,21 was itself one of the six undefined solutions.  As I comment below, the clue for 18 (answer Oscar Wilde) was very easy and that left a relatively small body of work (4 plays, 1 novel and some stories) from which to choose.  5, 21 (Dorian Gray) also yielded pretty quickly but I have to confess to having to do some internet research to discover the names of characters in The Picture of Dorian Gray (highlighted in the grid in what I hope is an appropriately Wildean shade of blue).  Since many of the standard clues were relatively straightforward, the puzzle became relatively easy to complete.

This is, I think, the second time that Qaos has been given the prize slot and, by coincidence, I blogged the previous one as well (No 25,754).  I also found that puzzle on the easy side for a prize puzzle, but after last week’s tough challenge from Paul, I am grateful to be able to explain all the answers this week.

Qaos can be very concise in his clues (three of them have only two words each) and although there was much to admire, I did have a few quibbles.  Let the  debate begin!

prize26687

 

 

Across
5 DRAGON
Fabulous creature like a transvestite? (6)

DRAG ON.  A simple charade to get us started.
6 TARIFF
Endless traffic problem leads to toll (6)

*TRAFFI(c).  I don’t particularly like “problem” as an anagram indicator.
9 GRAPES
Perhaps gorillas eat less fruit (6)

GR(eat) APES.  Difficult to see straightaway, perhaps because of the difference in pronunciation.  However, does “eat less” really mean “remove eat”?
10 HALLWARD
Entrance with drawback? (8)

HALL WARD (draw rev).  The first of the themed characters.
11 VANE
Captured by CCTV — a neutrino! (4)

Hidden in “CCTV a neutrino”.  Another themed character.
12 PERMISSION
Licence for each business (10)

PER MISSION.  Another straightforward charade.
13 PLUPERFECTS
“Tenses up pecs” left Rita’s head giddy! (11)

*(UP PECS LEFT R(ita)).
18 OSCAR WILDE
O, much wit, then led astray? (5,5)

OSCAR (phonetic alphabet) WI(t) *LED.  Although a brilliant & lit, this was unfortunately a write-in, given the help from the introduction that we were looking for a writer.
21  
See 5 down
22 NOCTURNE
Change key after party rejected music (8)

CON(rev) TURN E.
23 GROUND
Arsenal’s French striker misses one, takes new position (6)

(Olivier) G(i)ROU(N)D.  As somebody commented on last week’s blog, to solve this clue you need to know (or be able to discover) the name of Arsenal’s French striker.  It was clearly signposted, so there’s no unfairness, but opinions will differ as to whether it’s appropriate.
24 TONGUE
Accent disguises government’s posh language … (6)

An envelope (“disguises”) of G U in TONE.
25 WOTTON
… with books by the hundred (6)

W(ith) OT TON.   The ellipsis helps to disguise the fact that this is another of the themed answers.
Down
1 CAMPBELL
Soup maker? (8)

A general knowledge clue for the next of the themed answers.
2 GOSSIP
Penny is very good to counter rumour (6)

P IS SO G(ood) (all rev).
3 CALLTIME
Stop talking on the phone? (8)

A very economical charade of CALL TIME.
4 TISWAS
It’s funny having looked over children’s TV programme (6)

*ITS SAW(rev).
5,21 DORIAN GRAY
Worshipping a lower light (6,4)

ADORING (with the A dropping – it’s a down clue – from the top to near the bottom, so lower) RAY.
7 FERMOR
More upset in France (6)

*MORE in FR(ance).  The final themed character.
8 CHARGRILLED
Cooked tea right? It’s to be seriously questioned (11)

CHA R GRILLED.
14 POWERFUL
Mighty intense (8)

Double definition.
15 TUGBOATS
Main towers? (8)

Cryptic definition.
16 ESCORT
Guard caught stealing gold after drugs (6)

ES, OR in CT.
17 TANNIN
It’s mostly hiding in red wine (6)

TANNIN(g).  I believe that tannins are also found in white wines, so perhaps this clue qualifies as a semi & lit.
19 ACTING
Pretending to stand in (6)

Another double definition.
20 EGGNOG
Drink, say, on lifting trophy (6)

EG GONG(rev).
*anagram

38 comments on “Guardian Prize 26,687 by Qaos”

  1. Thanks bridgesong. My sentiments exactly. 3 was my LOI and I wasted some time trying to find a sixth Dorian Gray character who would fit the crossing letters. TAILPIPE and NAILFILE didn’t get me far either. I guess CALL TIME can = STOP and also = TALKING ON THE PHONE but it seems to me to be drawing rather a long bow. It might have been better as (4,4).

  2. Thanks to Qaos and bridgesong. I too kept trying to get a sixth Wilde character for 3d and as a result failed to get CALLTIME (though the rest of the puzzle went smoothly). I did figure out GROUND with the help of Google and did finally understand the “eat” subtraction for GRAPES.

  3. Thanks bridgesong. Though the theme jumped out instantly the names that meant nothing were over on the right and had to be looked up at the three-quarter mark which was a disappointment. I note your comment on 23A: I give that clue a thumbs down.

  4. Eat less made me smile. On 23, I know nothing about football, and understand the reservations about this clue, but found the chap’s name in about a minute. But on another occasion I might be stumped. Oh, that’s a different sport altogether. Oops.

  5. Some interesting general knowledge required for this. I spotted VANE on the way through the clues before coming to the author or the book(s) and thought “Oh good, it’s the Peter Wimsey/Harriet Vane novels”, which rather shows what an acceptable general knowledge clue is: if I know it, it’s obviously fine, if I don’t, well, how was I expected to know that? As it turned out it took me an embarrassingly long time to get the theme, although in retrospect both main clues were neatly done. It must be more than 30 years since I read Dorian Gray, and about as long since I last followed Arsenal, so M. Giroud was a mystery to me, if not to Google. But I didn’t leave the UK until some time after Tiswas and still remember it fondly (OTT not so much), so that was an OK reference! My main problem with this crossword was the number of times I ended up with an answer lightly pencilled in; things like CALLTIME (surely two words?). But I enjoyed it, even with a few quibbles, so thanks to Qaos, and to bridgesong, of course.

  6. Thanks, bridgesong
    I intended to make exactly the same three comments that ACD made @ 2 about CALLTIME, GROUND and GRAPES. The rest was fine.

  7. Forgot to say that, unlike KeithS @ 5, I left the country over 40 years ago and had therefore never heard of Tiswas, but it was obvious from the wordplay, and a very plausible name for a children’s programme!

  8. We too were misled by the special instructions and failed to get 3d. Also think it should have been two words, or at least hyphenated. Apart from that, an enjoyable solve.

  9. CALLTIME doesn’t appear to exist as one word, even google’s ngram viewer can only find a single instance so the enumeration has to be wrong.

    23a is another example of a foopball fan thinking their hobby has any importance.

    9a is a sort of reverse ‘lift and separate’ thing, “eat less” having a hyphen missing.

  10. Thanks Qaos and bridgesong
    I thought this was unsatisfactory. OSCAR WILDE was a write-in, as was the obvious hidden VANE; Google rapidly did the rest (though I too tried for some time to find a character to fit 3d, my LOI too). A clue that actually requires knowledge of the name of a footballer, obscure to me at least, was unfair as well.

    On first pass I tried to justify APPLES for 9a (APES around PL?), but DORIAN GRAY showed it to be wrong; the replacement GRAPES was my favourite clue.

  12. What a dog’s dinner this was. A prime example of how a themed crossword shouldn’t be IMHO.

    It was soon obvious that the “theme” was Oscaor Wilde’s Picture of Dorian Gray. So, how many people know any of the characters in this book beside the protagonist. Not so many I would wager.

    If one was familiar with the work the puzzle was a walkover, if one chose to look up these unknown names, again a very boring solve. Finally if one chose to try and deduce the characters from the wordplay all that was left was a slog as there are many viable solutions, especially as the answers are proper names!!!! (A waste of a life in my opinion)

    Finally there was the “deliberate mistake” which made the final clue unsolvable. Luckily we know the Guardian and our revered editor so 3D could only be CALL TIME with a letter count of 8!!!! (Dreadful) (Re an earlier comment here. I have searched for 15 minutes a nd can’t find calltime as one word in my Chambers 1993)

    Worst ever puzzle from Qaos for me. I looked up the characters filled in the grid in 15 minutes and spent 15 minutes puzzling over 3D. A great disappointment for our “weekend treat”.

    Once a “suitable crossword” has been chosen/randomly picked surely it is not too much to ask that it is checked before and after proof setting?

    Thanks to bridgesong and Qaos.

  13. Brendan @12 (and others): CALLTIME is in the 2008 (11th) edition of Chambers, which is the oldest one I have to hand, as well as the current edition. It’s listed under CALL. The definition is: “1. The time available for use in making calls on a mobile phone. 2. The time used on a single phone call.”

  14. I too fell prey to some of the ambiguities of this crossword. But this puzzle is redeemed for me by the brilliance of 18A. It might be easy, very easy, even a write-in. But it is also a work of genius. How many other well-formed ( Ximenean even?) clues also serve as a complete biography? Bravo Qaos!

  16. I thought this rather unsatisfactory as well for the reasons which have been cited above. I’ve read DORIAN GRAY and heard radio dramatization of it but I certainly didn’t remember any of the characters so had to resort to Mr Google. The lack of a sixth character was not a clever misdirection but an example of sloppiness, and I don’t care what Chambers says CALLTIME is poor.
    It was rather an easy puzzle, especially for a prize, but it was the lack of care in the setting and the complete lack of any editing that made this a poorer experience than it might have been.

  17. Thanks Qaos and bridgesong

    For me too something of a curate’s egg, needed to look up the characters but thought some of the other clueing very elegant.

    Brendan @ 12: purely as a matter of interest, does your 1993 Chambers include ‘internet’ or ’email’?

  18. I don’t like this kind of theme. I’m not sure whether I’ve ever read the novel. Even if I have, I’d forgotten all the character names other than the eponymous one, so I had to resort to the internet to confirm some and learn others. Then there was the footballer …

    On TARIFF, I don’t mind “problem” as the anagrind, and “traffic problem” worked well as misdirection in this case, at least for me. I took CALL TIME as a dd, “stop” (with a space) and the minutes you buy as part of a mobile phone package (also called “airtime”, and written without the space). The second one is confirmed by the first definition bridgesong found in Chambers.

    Favourites were GRAPES and OSCAR WILDE (for the surface).

    Thanks to Qaos and bridgesong.

  19. The ‘work’ is ‘The Picture of Dorian Gray’, so I guess DORIAN GRAY qualifies as one of the characters. I spent an age looking for the sixth, but could not find even a ‘Jj’ or a ‘Leaf’.

    OSCAR WILDE was a great clue.

    Thank you Qaos and bridgesong.

  20. I was intrigued by this puzzle when I read the instructions. It started of well but then it turned into a list-ticking exercise once the theme was discovered. I much prefer it when setters choose themes with a long list of possibilities.

    I didn’t have any problem with football being used as required general knowledge. Football is by far and away the world’s mot popular spectator sport. If football is not common enough to be general knowledge then what is?

    I may not know much about football myself, but that just shows up the limits of my own general knowledge.

    Thanks Qaos and bridgesong.

  21. PeeDee @20
    I think there is a difference between knowing general facts about football and knowing the name of a particular overseas player. More importantly, there is a difference between the name being the solution and it being part of the wordplay. If the name had been the solution, the combination of the wordplay and the crossers should have made it possible to deduce it, then look up the answer for confirmation. In this case it was part of a fairly complex piece of wordplay, not just an anagram, with a definition which wasn’t immediately obvious. I wonder how many people who didn’t already know the name were able to solve it without recourse to the internet or a football-loving friend.

  23. 21 jenny –

    I don’t speak for anyone but myself here. My personal take on this one expects to be able to solve every clue of every puzzle unaided than one has to be very good indeed. That includes knowing a LOT of stuff. Ordinary general knowledge gets most people most of the answers most of the time. To get a 100% unaided record one needs an exceptional general knowledge.

    My view is that my failing to solve 23ac was exactly that, a failure on my part. I came up wanting. It is not the end of the world, I just had to look up the footballer in Wikipedia. 1-0 to Qaos.

    I do understand your point about general knowledge in the construction can make finding the answer difficult. My thought is that I like it that way.

  24. bridgesong @ 13

    Thanks for that

    So what is 3D

    A DD which doesn’t quite work as CALL TIME has a space. Or is it a Charade as you suggest. Isn’t the space still a problem? That question mark at the end is working extra hard in this case.

    All would surely have been resolved by a number count of (4,4)

    Simon S @ 17

    Yes my 1993 Chambers does have e-mail and internet (although it does prefer internetting? 🙂 )

    I use the WordWeb onle Shorter Oxford English Dictionary so I’ve no need or desire to invest in the “dead trees” versions.

  25. Brendan @ 24

    Thanks for that.

    I’m very interested in language and its evolution, so was wondering when terms like internet and email entered dictionaries, as pretty much de facto that postdates their specialist usage at the very least, though these days the time lag from specialist to general can be very short,

    Barry Miles wrote a very interesting book (London Calling) a few years back on the London underground movement of the 1950s-60s, and his final conclusion was that such an underground is no longer possible as the speed of knowledge/information transfer these days is so rapid that there is no possibility for anything like that to be seeded and to germinate in occlusion any more. In many ways that’s a shame.

  26. I can’t believe all the moans about the footballer. I often have to find names of composers, poets, authors, films, books, etc, etc, that I’ve never heard of.

  27. Entertaining, concise and fairly straightforward, except that it took ages to see CALLTIME. Saw the theme very quickly – remembered most of the names but not FERMOR – fortunately that one was very clearly clued. No problems with the footballer.

    Thanks to Qaos and bridgesong

  29. I’m yet another who was stumped by CALLTIME, thinking it should be a 6th character. Oh dear! Apart from that I enjoyed the puzzle.

  31. Peedee puts it very well; who hasn’t had to look up something either to check spelling or simply lack of knowledge? Before the omniscience of Google, rifling through various reference books was even part of the joy of crosswords. It isn’t compilers fault that it is now much easier to turn to the keyboard but it would be interesting to discuss how to avoid resorting to the web.
    As for call time (my spell checker put in the space!), Auraucaria’s test for legitimacy of a clue was “can it be reasonably solved”? As most people seem to have succeded, it passes IMHO. it’s a double definition, so choosing 8 over 4,4 is almost arbitrary.

  32. timon @31

    You make my points almost exactly but bizarrely come to the opposite conlusion!

    If it’s a DD can the two answers have different letter count? (I think not)

    And although most people did “solve” CALLTIME they only did so after much musing and in most cases thinking the published number count was in error. (So not “arbitrary” in my opinion.)

    I also agree that part of the joy of the “good old” Prize crosswords was that one sometimes had to rummage through reference works. I fondly remember sneaky Saturday linchtime trips from the pub to the nearby bookshop in Preston (using a bookshop as a library! Naughty). I also once made a quick visit from a Norwich pub to the great library there. (Sadly it burned down a few weeks later! Not guilty!)

    My gripe was not about having to use aids. The problem was that once one had the information the puzzle became trivial. One puzzle in the past I remember obliquely referenced “not further defined” characters from “The Canterbury Tales”. However it was a hell of job to find them and fit them in!

  33. I’m an old-fashioned solver who uses reference books (as a last resort),learning much in the process, without internet aid. I spend far too much time online battling with Twitter and aged laptop to think about adding computer-aided answers. My family can’t understand why I do this!

  34. Sylvia’s comment got me thinking about general knowledge in crosswords.

    Not long ago the only recourse for looking stuff up was in paper reference books. These were expensive and people did not have many and they had were often not the latest edition. General knowledge used in crosswords tended towards the historical and well established because that was what solvers had available. Editors weeded out references that had not yet stood the test of time.

    The Internet has changed all that, comprehensive current information is available to all at low cost. However a computers/smartphone in every home has only become a reality this decade. I don’t think that crosswording tradition has caught up with the modern environment yet. The current footballer reference would not have been fair only a few years ago.

  35. PeeDee @34
    While the point you make is valid, I think there are other considerations, such as to what extent setters should assume solvers of cryptic crosswords will want or be able to look up unfamiliar GK, and what it is fair to assume actually is GK. That will depend in part on their target audience, which itself may change over time.

    Some (most?) of us do cryptics because we like the problem-solving aspect. If I wanted to test my GK, I’d do a quiz. I don’t mind clues involving topics which don’t interest me, but I prefer them to be solvable from the word play, leaving me just needing to check them from reference sources. I don’t think I should be expected to do a lot of detailed online research.

    I usually solve the Guardian at home online, so it is easy (sometimes too easy) to do online research, but a lot of solvers like to do crosswords while travelling. Not all travellers have smartphones and generous data allowances. Assuming that solvers are able to access online sources while solving excludes some of them just as much as assuming all solvers have access to large paper reference books would do.

    As for what should be assumed to be GK, obviously that depends on many factors. Once upon a time, someone tackling a crossword in a broadsheet newspaper could probably be assumed to have had an education which included some Latin and/or Greek, a lot of ancient history (and an Anglo-centric version of modern history), classical music, writers such as Shakespeare and the major poets, and so on. They would also have had a good knowledge of current affairs, and probably of cricket. What can Guardian cryptic setters safely assume about their typical solvers today? Probably not that they know much Latin or Greek. Should setters assume we are all familiar with modern literature? How famous does a footballer or cricketer or pop singer or actor have to be for setters to assume we will at least have heard of them?

    I don’t think there are easy answers, but if setters choose to include clues which require GK which may not be all that “general” among their solvers, they shouldn’t be surprised when they get some complaints.

  36. To clarify my comment @34 – the last sentence is better expressed as : “The current footballer reference would not have got past the editor only a few years ago.”. I’m not trying to say it should be universally considered fair.

    jennk @43 – like a said before, personally I like it when I have to research material to finish a crossword (online or otherwise). It is one of my the things I like best about crosswords. The points you details as drawbacks I see as a bonuses.

    I’m not suggesting my way of thinking is better, right or even desirable; or that you or anyone else should adopt it. Its just how I approach the puzzles myself.

  37. Thanks bridgesong and appreciation to Qaos.

    I’m finding these themed puzzles a bit grating – especially in this case where there are such a limited number of characters to choose from.

    So once I had Oscar Wilde the themed answers were all straightforward.

    Add to that a feeling of having been short-changed by the grid, then a bit of a poor show really.

  38. Thanks Qaos and bridgesong

    CALLTIME finally dropped a few weeks on to finally get this one finished last night (25/10). Didn’t have issues with the clue or the enumeration – think that calltime (one word) was the definition for voice time on a mobile phone plan – the cryptic ‘call time’ to end something is then valid. The misdirection of the ‘sixth character’ being Dorian himself then works.

    An interesting puzzle that I didn’t find easy. Had read the novel, but had well and truly forgotten all of the characters other than the protagonist. Resisted the temptation to look down the wiki list of characters – instead used it to verify a character once it was worked out from the clue.

    TISWAS and PLUPERFECTS were both new and required referenced look ups.

Comments are closed.