Guardian 25,878 / Brummie

58 comments on “Guardian 25,878 / Brummie”

1. I took ‘Cate’ to be a reference to Ms. Blanchett. A bit weak I thought.

2. re 17 Cate Blanchett was christened Catherine, so Cate is a ‘familiar’ form.

3. Thanks, Eileen. Apart from the obvious theme, the double appearance of DOUBLE made me wonder if there were more going on… FIG appears twice two as does IRISH. The interesting thing is the alternative combinations scattered around the grid (e.g SWISS ROLL) – although it takes a stretch to find the “LUCK of the IRISH” in PLUCKY. Unfortunately, I can’t seem to double-match them all, so maybe I’ve not quite twigged Brummie’s game.

4. … twice too, of course. 🙁

5. Enjoyable puzzle although I was slow to get going on it and I found the SE corner the most difficult, with 20d being the last in (probably because my brain seizes up when certain sports or “electronic problems” are mentioned in the clue).

   My favourites were DOUBLE CHIN, UNCOUTH & DUTCH COURAGE.

   I was not sure how to parse ‘bow’ in 10, 12/7 (no wonder I couldn’t parse it – I got it wrong, having put in SWISS MONTEGO!) and 17.

   Regarding 17, I also parsed it as CAT = familiar + GORY, but then had a problem with the ‘e’. If CATE (Blanchett, for example) + GORY I did not see the need for ‘familiar’ in the clue.

   Thank you for this blog, Eileen.

6. Hi NeilW

   Not for the first time, you’ve seen a bit more than I did. 😉

   I’ve just spotted DOUBLE DUTCH.

7. Regarding the clue for 20/25, does ‘the Guardian’ always equal ‘OUR’? I’ve seen it before but I forgot to ask about it.

8. FIG ROLL?

9. Hi Michelle

   Here, the clue was ‘of the Guardian’, so OUR, but ‘Guardian’ crops up quite often as WE or US – certainly worth filing away!

10. Thanks Brummie and Eileen; most enjoyable and nice to finish after failing on Wednesday and having a disaster yesterday! I take it the mini-theme is simply the embedding of nations; I would have enjoyed a ‘scotch’ if you see what I mean. Oh, btw, I agree with Duncan @ 2 re. the divine Cate.

    Quite a week.

11. michelle @7, sometimes “we”, depending on the case – and, of course, sometimes it’s a double bluff and something else entirely!

12. Sorry, Eileen, for stepping on your toes!

13. Hi. One use of a violin bow is to make a slur – ie the opposite of detached notes.

14. Sorry you missed out on your scotch, dunsscotus!

    As NeilW points out, there’s a bit more to it than the five nations! [I’m just glad that I didn’t comment, as I was going to, that it was a pity that Brummie had repeated DOUBLE in the answers!] I think you’re stretching your violin bow a bit, though. 😉

    Re Cate Blanchett: I thought I’d made it clear that I knew that was who was mweant – but I still don’t see the need for ‘familiar’, as I’ve never seen or heard her called anything else

15. Thanks Brummie and Eileen
    I failed on DOTCOM, and couldn’t understand DRUM ROLL and SLEPT OUT. On the other hand, DOUBLE ACT was a delight when the penny dropped, and several other were pleasing.

16. Nice puzzle, and thanks for the blog, Eileen, and to NeilW for pointing out the more subtle theme.

    Regarding Ms. Blanchett, the more usual familiar form of her name would be Kate, which perhaps justifies the wordplay “Familiar female film star”

17. This looks, more and more, like a work in progress – around the perimeter we have AA, NN, MYMY and, nearly SS – maybe it’s a coincidence or maybe Brummie just gave up on it.. Perhaps he’ll drop in and tell all!

18. Stella @16, in that case, wouldn’t “unfamiliar” have been more appropriate? In any case, see Duncan @2 who, I think, nails it.

19. Thanks Eileen for the parsing of some of the answers that I got lucky with. I got 24,15 first and ended with 2. Concentrating on solving I had missed the theme completely and I’m impressed by extra layer of the alternative combinations possible.

    As a visitor to southern Spain I know AGAVES well. The bottom part of the plant is a huge rosette of spiky leaves, but it is the spectacular flowers that I love. They are taller than me (as my son would say – not difficult): http://www.flickr.com/photos/30421548@N07/7183818459/

20. Eileen@9 & Neil@11
    thanks, I will file away the various possibilities

21. Neil@8
    how about DOUBLE LOCK?

22. Thanks for the blog, Eileen. Missed the theme, though I did spot that there was a lot of doubling up.

    (Glad to return to the blog after weeks of lurking…it’s been a very testing time personally, featuring sudden admission of husband to hospital, followed by house move! All sorted now, thankfully 🙂 )

23. Excellent crossword with accurate cluing and the different layers of themes [have we got them all?]

    Thanks Eileen; sterling job as ever. There is also, apparently, a double roll. Well done, Michelle for spotting double lock. Wikipedia gives: ‘Catherine Élise “Cate” Blanchett,’ so as above I suppose that is the reason for the ‘familiar.’ CATEGORY is a synonym of family, although I doubt whether the connection was intended as it wouldn’t really parse.

    I particularly liked DOUBLE CHIN, IRISH STEW and VIOLIN BOW (where, of course, I got misled by the Bob Kennedy at first.)

24. It’s good to see you back, liz @22 – I’ve missed you.

    I’m glad things are better now and expect we’ll be hearing more from you. 😉

25. Thanks Eileen and Brummie

    More going on here than I saw in a hasty solve which didn’t do justice to a puzzle that needs a solver like Yossarian in Catch22 who ‘saw everything twice’.

    I missed out on ‘parsing’ bow and on reference to ‘chin chin’.

    I liked 21a.

26. Robi #23 – “have we got them all?”

    Doubt it – probably more though mainly tenuous I guess.

    I’ve certainly seen an advert somewhere for a ‘Double Bath.’ ‘Irish Drum’ is a possibility and here’s a link to an interesting ‘Dutch Cottage’:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_Cottage

27. michelle, I’ll echo Robi – well done on DOUBLE LOCK. This is my favourite type of crossword, where there are so many hidden layers, irrelevant to the quick solve.

28. Robi@23
    thanks – just found one more – FISH STEW

29. The Greek Star is apparently a newspaper in the US for the Greek community!

30. NeilW@27
    thanks Neil – you are, after all, one of my (many) mentors on 225. I’m glad to get your praise!

31. michelle, thanks, but… mentor? Believe me, I’m still a learner!

32. Thanks, Eileen.

    Isn’t it “familiar” (17d) to address or refer to someone by only their first name?

    Incidentally,the “Duchess of Fife” explanation for [my old] Dutch is almost certainly folk etymology, as the term predates the creation of the title Duke of Fife. http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/my-old-dutch.html

33. Thanks to Eileen for the blog. I had been puzzled by ‘old-style toast’ in 5,17 because I had totally forgotten chin-chin as a spoken term.

    A distant memory tells me that the sound of chin-chin is offensive to Japanese people but I have never understood this. Can anybody clear it up?

    When I saw Murdoch in 14,6 I thought of Rupert and his family – no help at all. Eventually I spotted Iris 🙁

34. Neil@31 – no need to be so “humble” – you are obviously very good at solving cryptics.

    By “mentors” I mean everyone who has been encouraging or informative on 225, so apart from the bloggers I can think of the following as “mentors” (sorry, no capitals in this list): neilw, kathryn’s dad, william, tupu, muffin, rowly, rcwhiting, gaufrid, derek lazenby, coltrane, hkcolin, giovanna, simon, nametab, mitz, rhotician, huw powell.

    All in all, I’m glad I discovered this website.

    BTW I completed last Saturday’s Prize puzzle, and I’m eager to see the answers tomorrow.

35. Michelle @ 34
    I am honoured to be included in such a distinguished line-up!

36. Hi chas

    Both Chambers and Collins [and Brewer’s] give chin-chin as being Chinese [please, please] with no mention of Japanese. However, I found this:

    http://www.i18nguy.com/humor/chin-chin.html

    [I suspect that you were being mischievous, as you could have googled for yourself. 😉 ]

    Hi Miche @32

    Chambers and Brewer’s also both give the Duchess of Fife origin for Dutch, but I had heard before – and forgotten – about the controversy.

    And hi, Michelle @34

    I think we’re all each other’s mentors here – that’s one of the great things about this site! Congratulations on finishing the Prize [and all the other recent ones]. I don’t think you’ve called yourself a beginner for a day or two – quite rightly! [But, as NeilW [almost] says, we’re all still learners.]

37. Eileen@36
    I agree with you, we’re all still learners. Viva 225!

38. Oh, Eileen, please don’t put yourself in the same basket: some are more equal than others! 🙂

39. I doubt that this planned, but I’ve just realised that all the answers can be found in ‘double’ words – apart from the obvious ones, there is: racial slur; plucky duck; uncouth youth; age category; prayer shawl; and even Baron von Ghoulish

    from Nobby Robi 😉

40. A fabulously enjoyable puzzle. Loads of fun. Even the write-ins such as (16,22) and (20,25) were a joy. Thanks Brummie

41. Hi NeilW

    Please see my comment 6!!

42. Eileen @36: thanks for the link – that explains what I heard about quite a few years ago.
    As you say I could have googled it myself but there are still things about WWW that I just do not instinctively do. I suppose it comes of my age – I retired a couple of years ago.

43. Eileen, unwarranted, but thank you.

    Robi, I think that may be a bridge too far – I can only echo my earlier sentiment that it would be great if Brummie would drop in. Sadly, he only seems to do so when the comments are negative.

44. Neil @43; I was being a bit tichy. I don’t always mean what I say. 🙂

45. Hi Robi

    So long as you follow Afrit’s lassic injunction [Armchair Crosswords, 1949]:

    “You need not mean what you say, but you must say what you mean”

46. That should be ‘classic injunction’.

47. Good end to the week, I thought. The possibility of a theme dawned after getting SWISS and TURSKISH in early on, but it didn’t occur to me after that. Cleverly done, in hindsight.

48. Thanks all
    A nice exercise in solving a puzzle while entirely avoiding all spurious double-sided-tracks.
    My only problems were ‘drum-roll’ which I couldn’t accept as CD;
    and ‘ghoulish’ which I thought very clever and precise (which is probably why I took so long to get it).
    I did decrypt 3d easily but the plant was new to me.
    Tramp, Philistine, Picaroon, Brummie – a much higher quality run, thankyou Guardian.

49. Thanks, Eileen.

    Like others, I enjoyed this one. Brummie is one of those compilers who I often struggle with, and it’s just a ‘wavelength’ thing, because his clueing is precise. I should be getting better, because he’s pretty much a once per month man, so I’ll have had a go at a few.

    I thought VIOLIN BOW was particularly creative today, but there was good stuff elsewhere too. I saw a few countries scattered around the place but cba to really track down all the links.

    I too would hesitate to call myself a ‘mentor’ (but thank you anyway, Michelle); however I do remember when I first started contributing here a few years ago, people were very helpful and friendly when I asked daft questions. Some folk say that they started out solving cryptics in a group, with friends or work colleagues, and I guess this blog is the cyberspace version of that – if someone can’t get or understand a solution, then someone else will.

50. With RCW on drum roll. Am I missing something? Lots of alternative cd’ s jump to mind. Otherwise a pleasant run out.

51. KD
    “Some folk say that they started out solving cryptics in a group, with friends or work colleagues, and I guess this blog is the cyberspace version of that –”
    Not in my experience,it isn’t.
    The former,in an all-male work-force, was a ruthlesss dog eats dog competition.The first test was to hear the clue read out to a shuffling crowd of 6 or 8; then to spot any crossers and the enumeration and finally shout the solution before anyone else.
    We warmed up on the D.Tel. and then played the main event – The G.
    When I started, getting one success per lunch hour was sublime,and I always tried to read the completed grid after the scrimmage had dispersed.
    Happy days.

52. Sorry about your experience @51, RCW. I agree with KD. I learned as an apprentice, journeyman and competent (still awaiting master status) in school staff common rooms at lunchtimes (when pressure of marking allowed).

53. thank you Eileen and Brummie.

    A fitting friday offering and treat. I missed the 2nd layer of the theme so thank you to 225 for adding to the enjoyment.

54. As regards the “familiar” film star: Those of us with any manners at all know that she is Ms. Blanchett. If you call her Cate, you’re being excessively familiar.

55. To say Chin is, here in Italy, quite common but of course it is spelt “cin” here, I think that chin chin is slightly less common but not unknown. Maybe it was more common in times past but along with many phrases that got brought over to the UK and made popular by such as Julian and Sandy, they have not evolved as they do in their source country. Been living here just over a year and never yet heard cin cin but my wife confirms that it is still in use.

56. Chin-chin does indeed mean the male member in Japanese slang – it’s pronounced cheen-cheen.

57. muffin @52
    No need for ‘sorry’, it was a great time. The only way to learn(?)
    Some of the personal comments about the compilers after a disappointment would have sent half this MB off to bed with an attack of the vapours.

58. I think Irish courage is a synonym for Dutch courage…

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