Inquisitor 1298: A Win for Surrey by Nudd

18 comments on “Inquisitor 1298: A Win for Surrey by Nudd”

1. Can’t really say I totally completed this but I did manage to fill the grid and spot James IV hiding in it, and identified the quotation. Just couldn’t work out what all the extra Scottish words were. Still, that was three in a row where I completed the grid, which I don’t think I’ve managed before (albeit with a week off as you can’t get The Independent in Texas).

   Just as I was getting the theme, a news item appeared on The Independent newsfeed about how James IV’s final resting place is now a golf course in Surrey, and at first I thought this is what the title referred to. It was only after a bit more research I discovered about the Earl of Surrey.

2. Like Hihoba I was looking for a cricketing theme until I had sufficient leading letters to identify the quotation from the ODQ. I then let out an inward groan as I realised that all the extracted words so far had been Scottish and that all those I had still to get would also be Scottish. The use of such words seems to be a favourite ploy amongst Inquisitor setters but it is one that leaves me vaguely dissatisfied. I always feel it leaves non-Scottish solvers at a disadvantage although I suspect that most of the words will be unfamiliar to Scottish solvers as well. Perhaps someone from north of the border would like to comment.

   Otherwise this was another most enjoyable Inquisitor which was solved at a steady pace through the weekend. I found the clues, once those annoying Scottish words had been identified, precise and fair. My favourite clue was 15a in the way that extraction of “tid” reversed its sense entirely. I assumed that “S” was required in the middle square both from the quotation and the fact that it wasn’t blacked out.

   Many thanks to Nudd for the crossword and to Hihoba for the blog

3. Thanks HiHoBa for the blog and thanks to Nudd for the puzzle.

   I am Scottish but I’m no critic either. I have never attempted to read Marmion and nor am I ever likely to. It is interesting to see the “tangled web” quote though.

   I liked the misdirection of some of the clues and answers suggesting a cricket theme – it’s always nice to be led up the garden path like that. 😉

   My biggest gripe is with 5d) I got the answer but I had no idea how it really worked. I’d never heard of Chick Corea either. I thought that the unwritten rule for including people was that they had to be dead and famous (except in the case of Her Majesty and Ernie Els.) Does this mean that anyone with an entry on Wikipedia is now fair game for inclusion in crosswords?

4. Howard @2 – Words in Chambers Dictionary, be they Scottish, Australian, Spenserian, Shakespearian, South African, American, archaic, obsolete, dialect or even medieval Roman (numeral) are all fair game for the barred cryptic setter. They are sometimes made more obvious (or perhaps obscure) by epithets such as Ed’s Will’s no longer local for Ian of Perth – but not necessarily. Some sometimes seem unfair (O for 11 in a recent inquisitor, perhaps) but when they are explained make me curse and go and read my Chambers more diligently.

   What I think I am trying to say is that there are lots more than just the Scots words that can be annoying!

   Thanks for both the crossword to Nudd and for the blog to Hihoba.

5. The rubric said “more appropriately than usual The Chambers Dictionary (2001) is recommended”.
   Is this because Chambers is base in Edinburgh?

6. A third option for the “extra” letter in the central column is the crossed swords OS battle symbol. No-one to my knowledge (apart from Scott) calls the site anything other than Flodden Field and I perceived the choices as being between leaving it blank and putting in something symbolic. The former seemed feeble hence my choice of the latter. But unlike Another Crossword all that matters here is the lucky hat-drawing process which means that it’s pretty unlikely that anyone will have to adjudicate on my crossed swords …. but if I win I promise to let you know.

7. John @4 I guess my moan would have some validity if the Scottish words were in common use north of the border. I suspect they’re not so it’s probably just paranoia on my part which unfortunately has now been reinforced by the observation from jonsurdy@5!

8. Well, I thought Chick Corea was famous, and I’m not a jazz fan. 🙂 Famous enough that Miles Kington made a joke on his name back when he did his column in the Indie, and I already knew the name then.

9. Two points on the comments on this. Re#3, I think not including names of living people in a puzzle is mainly associated with the Times daily cryptic, but not so much elsewhere. Re #5, I think Chambers Edinburgh office closed a few years back – I think they are now part of Collins.

10. Re nmsindy @9. I have just checked and Chambers is now part of Harraps.
    So I wonder if the significance is that the ‘Scots’ have come over the border into England, with the 2011 edition being the first?

11. Another inventive Inquisitor!

    Our experience in solving the puzzle was much the same as Hihoba’s. We struggled to find the extra word in 16d and it wasn’t until we had the quotation that we were able to parse it.

    We hadn’t heard of woopie and had a good laugh when we searched in Chambers. We also wondered why Chambers 2011 was recommended. Perhaps jonsurdy @10 is correct!

    Thanks Hihoba and Nudd.

12. Come on! Chick Corea was one of the greats! Given the plethoa of references to the world’s dullest sport (known to some of you as ‘cricket’) in crosswords, it was lovely to have a jazz clue.

    I resolutely refused to fill in the gap between Flodden and Field. Not sure if that was right.

    I read the poem while studying EngLit at university. It is dreadful.

13. Hihoba, many thanks for the fine blog, very well presented, and much appreciated – as are all the other comments here. I wanted to clue this one thematically, hence the rout of all those Scottish words. Sorry if the (2011) threw anyone – the point of the reference was just to Chambers, long renowned for its inclusion of so many Scottish (and Shakespearean and Spenserian etc) words compared to many other dictionaries.
    I make no apology for Chick Corea, a jazz piano legend – don’t complain, try listening to some of his work. I also intended the Oval and Boycott (and White at 38d) references – how could a Yorkshire fan resist when prompted by the sight of ‘Surrey’ in any context? I’m pleased that, as intended, it managed to slightly divert some solvers before pennies started dropping seriously.
    I do hope the IQ team will view kindly those entries not highlighting the ‘s’ – I used it because of the Scott quote but the possessive rarely occurs in any other context so I’d personally be happy with non-shading or other thematic treatment of that cell.

14. I really enjoyed this puzzle – apart from the FloddensField/ Flodden Field dilemma. To me, there is no arena called Floddens Field – there is only Flodden Field. But choosing the latter would mean leaving a blank cell, something I’ve never done in a crossword unless I’m explicitly told to. I gritted my teeth and highlighted FloddensField.

    I’m sure there must have been others who completed this crossword without getting any or all of the 36 words. I found the preamble so daunting, I decided just to get on with solving clues and didn’t try to extract anything. Much to my surprise, I managed to fill the grid. I did, admittedly, have some answers that I couldn’t parse totally – but if they fitted parts of the clue, I just shrugged and thought ‘that must involve another preamble bit’. I can’t remember now how much of ‘Flodden…’ appeared, but it was enough for me to see, and enough for me to get to James IV.

15. Thanks to Nudd for his helpful comments at #13.

    My comment on Chick Corea was not meant as any form of complaint, merely to highlight a) my ignorance and b) the fact that not knowing something is no bar to solving clues in this electronic age. I did however think that “chick” referred to CORA and spent ages trying to make NE mean note!

    Thanks to Ross at #12 for confirming my impression of Marmion!

16. A delightful puzzle from Nudd – not that difficult, but rather enjoyable. He was playing with us, including all those cricket misdirections. (White at 38d passed me by – is this the Australian Cameron W?)

    kenmac @3: my rule of thumb for the inclusion of references to people is that they have an entry in Chambers Biographical Dictionary (bought a few years ago after Schadenfreude’s puzzle based on 36 poets, some pretty obscure). Chick Corea is in there (but so are Jeremy Clarkson & The Spice Girls), and I recall blogging an IQ puzzle in which “Pop maybe …” clued “Iggy” as part of the wordplay – fair game in my book.

    I usually agonise over any ambiguity in the preamble, but here I had no problem – I simply inserted “‘S” (with apostrophe) in the unchecked cell.

    Up until today, I’d thought that the “tangled web” quote was Shakespearean, probably Hamlet, witches – so thanks to Hihoba for the blog, and once again to Nudd for the workout.
    (Thank goodness the puzzle was published a few days before the anniversary, which was well covered in the few days following.)

17. Thank you HolyGhost … Cameron White would indeed have been neatly thematic, but I was actually thinking of Craig when I wrote the clue (another Yorkshire lad, even if he did grow up in Oz)
    I too originally thought the ‘tangled web’ was a Shakespearean quote until I found it in wading through chunks of Marmion when compiling this (not an experience to be repeated in a hurry). I’m afraid I have to agree with Ross & Hihoba on the qualities of that epic poem.

18. Good night Nudd. Thank you for a great puzzle that challenged on so many levels.

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