Independent 8709 / Klingsor

When we saw that it was Klingsor we expected some tricky clues and  were not disappointed. There were even a few that we had to ponder over again when we came to write up the blog!

Joyce hates the term ‘& lit’ partly because when anyone uses it, someone else seems to dispute it. However, in writing up the blog this week there were four clues which could be described in this way ………  or maybe not! Bert’s just checking this through – he doesn’t like ‘&lit’ either, but he tends to use ‘cryptic definition’ for this type of clue.

Thanks Klingsor for the enjoyment!

Across
1   He’s in a tragic play, primarily? Could be?
THESPIAN An anagram of HE’S IN A + T + P (first letters of Tragic Play or ‘primarily’) anagrind is ‘could be’. The whole clue is also the definition so it could be described as ‘& lit’ but Joyce hates using this term!
5   Lackey regularly returns bearing a cake
ECLAIR LaCkEy (regular letters only) reversed or ‘returning’ + AIR (bearing)
10   Abandon reserve and be a disappointment to shock?
LET ONE’S HAIR DOWN This is a play on the fact that SHOCK = HAIR and DISAPPOINTMENT = LET DOWN. Joyce liked the idea behind the clue but is not totally convinced that it worked. Bert disagrees as he solved the clue – something that might a disappointment to one’s hair would let it down! Quite what that might be is another matter!
11   Depend on a husband disposed to be generous
OPEN-HANDED An anagram of DEPEND ON A H (husband) anagrind is ‘disposed’
13   Fix wimp’s wheels
STEW WET’S (wimp’s) reversed or ‘wheeling’
15   Stealthily moving Liverpool’s first away fixture
FITTING FlITTING (stealthily moving – as in a midnight flit) without L (Liverpool’s first)
17   Quite agree at first
TOTALLY TALLY (agree) with TO (at) first
18   Moving chapter along, author perhaps makes a pile
REACTOR CREATOR (author) but moving C (chapter) further along!
19   Sea area a couple of leagues east of Gibraltar?
ROCKALL A + LL (couple of leagues) after or ‘East of’ ROCK (Gibraltar)
21   Wheedle soft drinks from speaker
COAX Sounds like COKES (soft drinks) when said or ‘from speaker’
22   Performing comic operas without a viewer for the minute
MICROSCOPE An anagram of COMIC OPERAS (anagrind is ‘performing’)
25   Is it last of back teeth (molar) needing treatment? Now we’re getting somewhere!
THAT’S MORE LIKE IT An anagram of IS IT K (last letter in bacK) TEETH MOLAR (anagrind is ‘needing treatment’)
27   Part of organ, the reproductive bit of plant
ANTHER Hidden within the clue orgAN, THE Reproductive. This could also be described as an ‘& lit’ as the anther is part of the reproductive organ in a plant.
28   Doddering lecturer taking year over geographical alignments
LEY LINES SENILE (doddering) + L (lecturer) + around or ‘taking’ Y (year) all reversed or ‘over ‘
Down
1   Wealthy sort’s home to measure carpet
TELL OFF TOFF (wealthy sort) around or a ’home to’ ELL (measure)
2   Put away starter of lamb perhaps?
EAT mEAT (lamb perhaps) with the first letter or ‘starter’ omitted or ‘put away’. Oh no! Another ‘& lit’!
3   God, he exists in the heart of matter? Yes, ultimately – so they believe
PANTHEISTS PAN (god) + HE IS (exists) inside TT (heart of maTTer) + S (last letter of yeS or ‘ultimately’). And another………. !!
4   Copper ignored minister’s crime
ARSON pARSON (minister) ‘ignoring’ P (copper)
6   It helps preserve wine and port
CORK Double definition
7   Touring US city turned one old man to drink
AMONTILLADO An anagram of I (one) + OLD MAN TO (anagrind is ‘turned’) around or ‘touring’ LA (US city)
8   Peacekeepers must stop rising hostilities ever getting out of control
RUNAWAY UN (peacekeepers) inside or ‘stopping’ a reversal or ‘rising’ of WAR (hostilities) + AY (ever)
9   Scholar’s better organised – he could have you for breakfast!
MAN-EATER MA (scholar) + NEATER (better organised). Perhaps Bert would argue that being neater is not necessarily the same as being better organised. He says he is organised as he knows where everything is in his ‘office’ (he works from home) but it is definitely not neat (according to Joyce!).
12   Remaining houses to demolish finally abandoned – that’s wasteful
EXTRAVAGANT EXTANT (remaining) around or ‘housing’ RAVAGe (demolish) without last letter or ‘finally abandoned’
14   Before work, sells mobile? Absolutely not
STOCK STILL STOCKS (sells) before TILL (work)
16   Guitarist (in the style of J. ‘endrix) defending troops
GARRISON George Harrison (guitarist) written as G. ‘ARRISON
18   Funny sort reserves sandwich containing principally cheese
RICOTTA RIOT (funny sort) + TA (reserves) around or ‘sandwiching’ C (first letter of Containing or ‘principally’)
20   Will’s part revoked to make firm money
LAERTES SET (to make firm) + REAL (money) reversed or ‘revoked’
23   Wind up English magistrate
REEVE VEER (wind) reversed or ‘up’ + E (English)
24   Could be Man City’s second half
ISLE The second half of CarlISLE (city)
26   Earth before middle of Bronze Age
EON E (earth) before ON (centre of brONze)

 

14 comments on “Independent 8709 / Klingsor”

  1. Thanks, both.

    Fine puzzle from Klingsor, which I enjoyed. Just the last few that proved tricky. Some lovely surface readings too. Favourites today were REACTOR and LEY LINES.

    Liverpool, Man City, Carlisle – I keep saying it, but there’s far too much footie in the Indy.

    As for the assertion of &lits, I’d be closing the drawbridge and keeping your heads down for the rest of the day in case the ‘that’s not an &lit’ Rottweillers start baring their canines and slavering …

  2. I found this more straightforward than some of Klingsor’s previous offerings, and I thought it was an enjoyable solve. I got ROCKALL early on so had the first letter of 20dn, and when I read “Will’s part revoked” I briefly (very briefly) considered whether “codicil” reversed would make any sense. My last ones in were 1ac/1dn.

  3. Haha re the &lit thing, but 1ac does conspicuously lack a definition part! There’s another in today’s FT too. I don’t know if either is great, but bravo to the setters anyway.

    27 isn’t for sure, but gets the 15 Squared ‘extended definition’ rosette.

    Perhaps.

  4. Difficult as one has come to expect from Klingsor, but all very good.

    I couldn’t see why he uses the word ‘must’ in 8dn, as if it were necessary as in ‘I must leave’ rather than ‘I leave’. How could he be accused of breaking any rule if he had just left the word out (and the surface would be just as good, arguably better)?

  5. Will @4, the alternative is “Peacekeepers stop rising hostilities etc.”.
    That gives us “A stop B”.
    Some setters (including Anax, Tees and Klingsor) consider that as impure. For them, it should always be “A stops B”.
    As that is not possible here, the popular way-out is the use of “must”.
    A better surface is in this respect not part of the game.

  6. ….in any case, given the repeated ineffectuality of UN peacekeepers in meeting their remits, I hazard that an 8dn without “must” would be in rather bad taste!
    In all seriousness, thanks to Klingsor for a very pleasant solve. And thanks to B & J – I’m too tired this evening to overly concern myself with &lits far less to comment thereon!

  7. Well yes, Sil, I see your point and you may well be right. But is ‘UN’ definitely singular? It’s what Fowler calls a noun of multitude. Such nouns ‘are treated as singular or plural at discretion’. My discretion tells me that ‘peacekeepers’, although it is abbreviated by what seems to be a singular, is plural.

  8. And that is exactly it.
    ‘Peacekeepers’ is plural and therefore the setters I mentioned (and possibly others) do not accept “A stop B”.
    Why am I so sure about this?
    Because Anax ticked me off (in a friendly way) when I used an equivalent of “A stops B” in one of my own efforts, and also because Tees said a similar thing in an email some years ago.
    Meanwhile, I think I know Klingsor’s style (and vision on crosswords) well enough to put him in the same category.
    I might be wrong but I don’t think so.

  9. Surely “Cats eat food” is correct. A plural followed by a verb that doesn’t finish in s. Just like “Peacekeepers/UN stop rising hostilities …”

  10. Wil, I try one more time.

    The surface is not important. Of course, Cats eat food but (some) setters just break the clue in pieces.
    For them, “Cats” is a cryptic ‘unit’, a thing, a building stone. Similar for “food”.
    Therefore, they say that “Cats” eats “food”.
    Which doesn’t make any sense for the surface and is of course (language-) grammatically wrong, however in their eyes (crypto-) grammatically right.

    Some years ago, I had RI as part of a solution clued as “I follow rule” which Anax objected against.
    The thing that is “I” follows the thing that is “rule”.
    Because the cryptically correct “I follows rule” cannot be used within the surface, I had to turn to “I must follow rule” or “I will follow rule”.

    Tees told me a similar thing some years ago.
    Don’t shoot me, I’m only the piano player.

  11. Peacekeepers must stop rising hostilities getting out of control

    ‘UN stop’ or ‘stops’, would be okay, for those observing, or attempting to observe, Ximenean grammatical rules, since combination U+N can be seen as plural, or unit UN as singular: but here the (excellent) compiler uses a synonym for UN, thus complicating the U+N/ UN interpretation. Personally I don’t think that in the cryptic reading you can have U+N equal ‘peacekeepers’, and so ‘peacekeepers MUST stop’ is required.

    (Written whilst drunk after a smashing weekined, or even weekend.)

  12. Sil I’m sure we’re both well aware of the I leave/I must leave thing that Ximenes talks about in his book. My feeling was that this is a slightly different case, but perhaps not.

  13. I never read Ximenes’ book and I am not sure whether I ever will.
    I prefer to learn from blogs, comments, feedback, listening etc.
    “Peacekeepers” is cryptically a singular thing, therefore requires “stops”.
    That is not in line with the surface reading, so Klingsor turns to “must stop”.
    What Paul B (aka Tees) says is, if the clue had give us UN then “stop” would have been acceptable (seeing UN as U plus N, two things, plural).
    However, the clue didn’t give us UN.

    Paul B might have been drunk after a smashing weekend but, I think, he’s right.
    As is Klingsor.

  14. Four years too late, but the blog errs slightly in 22 across. It is an anagram of “comic operas without a”, the definition starts with “viewer”.

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