Inquisitor 1413: Seedy by Artix

18 comments on “Inquisitor 1413: Seedy by Artix”

1. Well done, Duncan for persevering.

   I got as far as Identifying MAE WEST but I didn’t (still don’t really) understand the “appropriate shape”. When I think of Ms West, a very different shape is conjured up!

   I found, what I thought were wines (some of them) and then, pretty much, gave up. 17d starts with an unfortunate group of 6 letters – surprised that got past the editor or did he, cheekily, “fail to notice” or was it a reference to guns and pockets??

   All-in-all, not in the running for puzzle of the year, IMHO 🙁

2. kenmac @ 1

   Yes – I spotted the first 6 letters of 17 down, but chose not to comment in the blog. I think it just fits with the SEEDY nature of the whole crossword.

   Look at life jacket logo to get a few images that bear some vague resemblance to the shape of the letters MAE WEST especially if you wrap the letters round BLONDE

3. I loved the puzzle, but not sure about 1A. The only definition I could find for LUM HAT was a hat shaped like a chimney – not an actual chimney pot. Have I missed something?

4. jonsurdy@3: chimney pot has a definition of “a top-hat (in full chimney-pot hat)”, so I think Mac’s chimney-pot is fair enough for lum hat.

   I thought the letters of Mae West formed her blonde hair. I think that the inflatable life jacket would not have been that shape to have attracted the nickname, as described in the derivation in Chambers. I highlighted the shape in yellow.

5. I agree that was something about this puzzle that didn’t endear itself to me I’m afraid.

   To say the quote is ‘famous’ is pushing it a tad.

   And the grapes are in some cases very obscure. Unless you knew them or had six hours on Google to spare I think it was very hard to even guess at a couple. I actually spent quite while on Google once I had the theme searching the grapes but didn’t find two of the ones here!

   I’m likewise still baffled by the ‘appropriate shape’.

   And the change from POCKET to PISTOL isn’t really showing appreciation at all is it?

6. I also went for highlighting Mae West in yellow, to represent her hair. I did wonder if the second quotation involved something about lying at her feet, in which case 28 across would have needed to change – but 12D didn’t seem the right shape to represent her person.

   I hadn’t come across, or can’t remember coming across, the ‘peel me a grape’ quote, and there seemed to be very few that could have been interpreted as an instruction, so I’m sure I would have remembered it. I did however spend some time enjoying many of her other quotes – a definite positive aspect of the puzzle.

   I found the puzzle as a whole hard going and the small grid with quite a few unclued lights didn’t give much to work with on some obscure clues. I only got 20D – PAKAPOO – by leafing through the PA… pages of Chambers (I’m definitely not a candidate for Duncan’s admiration).

7. I’m afraid I didn’t even think about the specific colour I should use when highlighting MAE WEST.

   Yellow or blonde does seem sensible given the relationship of the letters to the word BLONDE which could represent a body. As I’d already used yellow to highlight the word BLONDE I just chose a different colour. Yes, I know I didn’t need to highlight BLONDE, I’ve just done it to make the thematic material stand out better in the blog.

8. I have a more favourable impression of this puzzle than most of those that have commented. After finding RENACH quite early on & looking at it for a short while I guessed GRENACHE topped & tailed; I also had quite a few letters in {I wish that unclued entries were still numbered so we could refer to them easily} to suggest SANGIOVESE similarly treated. “Peel me a grape” immediately came to mind (but from having seen it performed by Blossom Dearie at one of her residencies at Pizza on the Park during the 1980s when I worked in London). This led to MAE WEST and the unclued 12d. And I don’t really have a problem with the shape of the ‘personal flotation device’. ALIGOTÉ & ZINFANDEL fell out, then CHARDONNAY gave me an inroad into the bottom right quadrant.

   I’ll agree that CONCORD (probably) and HAANEPOOT (definitely) are not well-known varieties, and I needed the list of unchecked and mutually checked letters to help me out here.

   On to the endgame. I did know the one about “Is that a … in your pocket, or are you just …” and check my ODQ for their version, which has PISTOL. I’m not sure whether changing POCKET to PISTOL is really a way to “demonstrate a form of appreciation”, but hey ho.

   Thanks to Artix for quite a reasonable Inquisitor debut, and to Duncan for the blog. (I’m sure that 11d is ISIAC – the alternative never occurred to me. And I assumed that Seedy simply referred to grapes having pips.)

   And kenmac @1: it seems that it’s not only beauty that’s in the eye of the beholder.

9. With wine being one of my passions and hobbies, I enjoyed this one, though it was quite a struggle to reach the PDM. Having uncovered Ms West, it did require a bit of googling to get the right quote and then things started to fall into place. (The potential life belt connection didn’t twig though)

   The grapes were all recognisable to me without reference apart from Haanepoot which I had never heard of, by that name anyway.

   Once the grid was full it took me an age to find the second quotation. I was convinced that 4D (Seamy) was a homonym type reference to “Come up and….” – perhaps her most famous quote (?) and spent an age trying to work something around that.

   I also had the Isiac/Isaac conundrum – I think I went for Isaac in the end which now looks wrong thanks to Duncan’s Divine Mother explanation

   I think I celebrated the grid completion with a decent glass or two of ino oi 🙂

   Thanks once again to Duncan for the blog and to Artix for the seedy fun.

10. Well, I’m with HolyGhost@8 on this one. I enjoyed it on the whole. Not all was straightforward though. It’s interesting to read in what order others managed to solve/deduce the various elements of the puzzle. I personally got the grapes/wine connection quite early, having seen the peeled SANGIOVESE, CHARDONNAY and CONCORD (a much more familiar variety in the US, where Concord grape juice is widely available in stores). I struggled then with the instruction: was this a culinary instruction for some fancy grape presentation ? After a brief diversion towards Stu Francis (he of the “crush a grape” catchline….but no blonde he !…I eventually got my brain in gear and deduced ‘peel’ and the quote soon followed.
    I had no problems with POCKET/PISTOL (Jessica Rabbit anyone ?), which to me seemed an unnecessary addendum to what was otherwise a perfectly acceptable thematic puzzle (less is more perhaps ?). Like others, I don’t get the shape (a bow, arch -like Mae West’s quotes – or curve ?) and I did think of the Mae West life jacket. Couldn’t settle on one though. OK, not top marks from me but a satisfying solve nevertheless. Thanks to Artix and Duncan.

11. Well this one completely defeated me – though I did enjoy the challenge.

    Can somebody please explain what this elusive shape is supposed to be?

12. I think if you rotate the grid by 90 degrees you will see a pixelated approximation of one of Mae West’s features.

    I enjoyed this puzzle immenesly.

    Many thanks to setter and blogger.

13. BF @12 – Oh dear, and there was us thinking that it reflected the shape of the flotation device which went around your neck!

    We enjoyed the puzzle and guessed along the way that grape varieties were part of the theme. After being stumped for a while, partly due to the unfamiliar grapes, Joyce thought about them being ‘peeled grapes’ and googled that together with quotation. We were then able to locate MAE WEST although for a while we both thought that there was only one W in the grid and were very confused.

    We saw GUNS in the grid and guessed the correct quotation. We spent almost as long looking for the changes required as we did solving the puzzle. When it eventually came it was a bit of a disappointment after the rest of the solve.

    Thanks to S&B.

14. This defeated me too. Having found Mae West (shaped more like a lum hat than a life belt, I’d say), I got caught up, thanks to the title, with her song “You gotta taste all the fruit”. Which, needless to say, I had no idea what to do with. Glad I gave up there, because if I’d got to grapes… I still wouldn’t have got very far.

    Thanks to Artix and Duncan.

15. I was defeated by this. I managed to solve all of the normal clues and got BLONDE (obviously!) and then ground to a halt. I was hoping the blonde would have been Marilyn Monroe, but no luck. Like Duncan I tried anagrams of trees varieties etc. I briefly started making my way down a huge list of blonde starts looking for likely quotes but gave up.

    On seeing the solution I was a little dismayed by “peel me a grape” as a famous quotation. If this is what Artix considers famous then I shudder to think what he calls obscure.

    The problem for me with this puzzle is that the crossword element is entirely unconnected with the rest of the puzzle. I completed all the clues without using the special instructions at all. Then one uses the special instructions without any reference to the cryptic crossword one has just done.

    I look forward to the weekly Inquisitor as an ‘enhanced’ cryptic crossword, but this was just two separate puzzles tacked together. Ultimately it is crossword bit that I enjoy; searching for rare grape varieties not even in the dictionary just doesn’t do it for me alone.

    Thanks Artix (for the bit I could do) and well dome Duncan!

16. PS – I forgot to add that like others I did not find the description of the shape as ‘appropriate’ helped. I suppose “an obscure shape that is difficult to identify” was appropriate for the puzzle in general!

17. PeeDee @15&16 interesting comment:

    “…the crossword element is entirely unconnected with the rest of the puzzle…”

    That doesn’t reflect any of the team comments, but please consider it noted. My own solving experience involved deducing BLONDE, then spotting the life-saver around her head/neck. Knowing the Beulah quote, the grapes and remaining clues helped to fill each other in.

    As I say, comment noted. Thanks!

    J

18. John and Artix,

    Just for the record, I don’t want to appear to be ungrateful in my comments above. I did enjoy the cryptic part of the solve and I have no illusions that my failure to get the rest was down to anything other than my own lack of knowledge/perseverance!

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