Guardian Cryptic 28,274 by Matilda

Apologies for the late post – I wrote this blog a couple of hours ago, but sent it to Fifteensquared as a draft by mistake.

An enjoyable Monday morning stroll…

… which proves that an easier crossword does not have to be a poor one. Apart from my understanding of a heretic being different from the setter’s, this was a fine puzzle. Some of the definitions were a bit loose, but the wordplay was always fair and straightforward enough to lead the solver in the right direction.

Thanks, Matilda

ACROSS
1 SALARY Sadly returned envelope of ready money (6)
<=ALAS (“sadly”, returned) + [envelope of] R(ead)Y
4 FRAMED Set up farm around central Sweden (6)
*(farm) [anag:around] + [central] (sw)ED(en)
9 TAKING THE PLUNGE Ridiculously negligent path — UK’s going for it (6,3,6)
*(negligent path uk) [anag:ridiculously]
10 PUNDIT ‘Double entendre’, says French expert (6)
PUN (“double entendre”) + DIT (“says” in “French”)
11 RELATION Helping to bring in the Spanish alliance (8)
RATION (“helping”) to bring in EL (“the” in “Spanish”)
12 MANGROVE Bloke and dog finally wander in vegetation (8)
MAN + (do)G [finally] + ROVE
14 DECODE Crack fish in river (6)
COD (“fish”) in (River) DEE
15 SHRIMP A shipmaster, when not at sea, ordered seafood (6)
*(shipmr) [anag:ordered] where SHIPMR is (a) SHIPM(aste)R without the letters of AT SEA
18 HEDGEROW Where God arranged protection for wildlife (8)
*(where god) [anag:arranged]
21 GREEN TEA Drink and entree prepared and consumed by gran regularly (5,3)
*(entree) [anag:prepared] comsumed by G(r)A(n) [regularly]
22 PRETTY Heartbreaker Tom assumes right to be good looking (6)
(Tom) PETTY (of Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers) assumes R (right)
24 AT SOME OTHER TIME Tim’s in here after stuffed tomatoes? Not now! (2,4,5,4)
TIM in HERE after *(tomatoes) [anag:stuffed]
25 CAKING 11s in prison, almost getting hard (6)
KIN (“relation” (the answer to 11 across)) in CAG(e) (“prison”, almost)
26 RELY ON Regarding French city trust (4,2)
RE (“regarding”) + LYON (“French city”)
DOWN
1 SPATULA St Paul converted with a blunt instrument (7)
*(st paul) [anag:converted] with A
2 LAIRD One is welcomed by fat landowner (5)
I (one) is welcomed by LARD (“fate)
3 RIGHT-HO Thigh or bum okay (5-2)
*(thigh or) [anag:bum]
5 RIPPLED Cross about political party leaders getting ruffled (7)
RILED (“cross”) about P(olitical) P(arty) [leaders]
6 MOUSTACHE Fancy costume with hat briefly worn in November? (9)
*(costume ha) [anag:fancy] where HA is HA(t) [briefly]

Men are encouraged to be sponsored to grow a moustache in November as part of the Movember campaign which raises money to help men’s health issues.

7 DOG FOOD Chow chow chow (3,4)
DOG (“chow”) + FOOD (“chow”)
8 CHARGE Changed gear after clutch casing damage (6)
*(gear) [anag:changed] after C(lutc)H
13 GUIDEBOOK Travel companion shows reserve following girl in uniform (9)
BOOK (“reserve”) following GUIDE (“girl in uniform”)
16 HERETIC One doesn’t believe the woman rejected quote (7)
HER (“the woman”) + [rejected] CITE (“quote”)
17 PATTERN Style talk on 3rd of June (7)
PATTER (“talk”) on [3rd of] (ju)N(e)
18 HEARTY Ambassador, cultured and exuberant (6)
HE (His or Her Excellency) (“ambassador”) + ARTY (“cultured”)
19 DEPLETE Reduce with diet pill oddly taken every Tuesday evening to begin with (7)
D(i)E(t)P(i)L(l) [oddly] taken with E(very) T(uesday) E(vening) [to begin with]
20 OTTOMAN Seat of empire (7)
Double definition
23 ENTRY Tip off guard to obtain access (5)
[tip off] (s)ENTRY (“guard”)

 

80 comments on “Guardian Cryptic 28,274 by Matilda”

  1. MaidenBartok

    Nothing to complain about here – nice, quick solve for me this morning.  Just no sign of Mr Raymond Luxury-Yacht to go with that mangrove.

    Thanks Matilda and loonapick!

  2. muffin

    Thanks Matilda and loonapick

    Yes, I agree about the definition for HERETIC – he believes, but just not the same as you do!

    3d was a bit irritating. Google seems to agree with me that the commoner expression is RIGHT OH! – I changed this only when I couldn’t get anything to fit 12a.

    Is Movember known outside the UK?

    Favourite was SHRIMP, for the appropriate surface.

  3. Wellbeck

    Having solved ENTRY, my original conviction was that 15A was KIPPER! But no….
    SALARY and PUNDIT were pleasing, and the anagram in 18A was so well-hidden that I stared at it for ages before I spotted the thing.
    Thanks to Matilda and Loonapick

  4. Boffo

    Thanks Loonapick and Matilda.

    More or less interchangeable, difficulty-wise, with Pan’s quiptic, I thought. Matilda’s up-to-date style continues to be refreshing in clues like MOUSTACHE and the nice subtext to TAKING THE PLUNGE.

    I’m not convinced by the definitions for CHARGE or CAKING, though, unless someone can steer me right.

  5. John Wells

    You’re right, loonapick. A heretic is not one who doesn’t believe, but one who doesn’t agree.

  6. Apple granny

    We enjoyed this. Lots of smiles. Had to Google moustaches in november. Likewise didn’t know Tom Petty. Lovely start to the day. Thanks

  7. HoagyM

    I think those two definitions are fine Boffo – “caking/getting hard” as in a damp substance like plaster or paint beginning to solidify, and “charge/damage” as in the phrase used in, say, a cafe “what’s the damage?”.  The definition I personally wasn’t sure of was 11a, “relation” meaning alliance.  Relationship would be OK, but relation??

    Lovely crossword btw, only blemish was the “political whinge” in 9a.  Really fed up with those types of clues now!

  8. Andy Smith

    Thanks for the blog. Lovely smooth surfaces. A heretic is someone who doesn’t believe the orthodox credo.

  9. yesyes

    Loved 24ac though it took some parsing. I agree with John Wells and Muffin regarding HERETIC.

     

    Thankyou Matilda and Ioonapick

  10. Mark Pettigrew

    I had a funny encounter with 9ac. My first attempt at the anagram came up with ‘nuking the planet’.

  11. Eileen

    A lovely puzzle! (I think we all agree about 16dn but it certainly didn’t spoil things.)

    I agree with HoagyM @7 re the definitions (thinking of removing caked mud from walking boots).

    Lots of nice clues – favourites were FRAMED, PUNDIT, HEDGEROOW, PRETTY, RELY ON, and CHARGE.

    Many thanks to Matilda for the fun and loonalick for the blog.

     

  12. copmus

    “heresy?” n. belief contrary to authorised teaching of the  religious community to which one ostensibly belongs?

    “My god is better than your god?”

    “I believe in God or Jesus but not the Virgin birth”

    Well done Matilda for a simple but excellent puzzle and managing to throw  a Winner in the Sparks

  13. Penfold

    Yes, I think a heretic would sing ‘I’m A Believer’.

    I would always go with ‘right ho’ as in Right Ho, Jeeves.

    Enjoyable start to the week. Finished ridiculously early due to being woken by a small dog that hasn’t grasped the concept of the clocks going back.

  14. essexboy

    Agree with others’ favourites, to which I would add OTTOMAN and 22a for not being Tom Jones.

    Thanks to setter and blogger (Eileen @11, he’s loonalickin’good 😉 )

  15. TassieTim

    Snap with multiple posters, and with loonapick, on HERETIC. I would say that a heretic definitely believes – it’s just that those beliefs are not the same things someone from a different sect believes. So two people can be mutual heretics to each other. Nice to see Tom Petty get a guernsey. I also liked TAKING THE PLUNGE (we can have as many snide political comments as the setters can manage in my book), DECODE (using both the first river and the first fish I tend to try), and RELY ON. And Penfold @13 – now I see what is making everything happen so late here – Pommy clocks have changed so what used to be a 9am start here is now 11 am. muffin @2 – we have Movember here in OZ. Thanks, Matilda and loonapick.

  16. Eileen

    Sorry, loonapick!

  17. MaidenBartok

    [Penfold @13 – Shouldn’t that be a “small dog that hasn’t grasped the concept of the clocks going bark.”  Coat on.]

    I was a little dubious on 25a – the last time I heard the phrase “caking over” was in relation a) to replacing the nasty silicon sealant around a shower tray or b) a disparaging remark about a woman who has over-done the war-paint and is now starting to set like a road surface.  But these were both many years ago and I notice the tube of B&Q bath/shower sealant now simply mentions that i should wait for it to “skin-over.”  But it wasn’t an unknown phrase…

  18. Anna

    Like others, didn’t know about moustaches in november thing.  And never heard of Tom Petty or the heartbreakers.

    But an enjoyable little start to the week.

    Thanks to Matilda and loonapick.

  19. PostMark

    Nice to see Matilda on a Monday; a refreshing change.  loonapick is so right that an “easier crossword does not have to be a poor one”.  Moving on from 16dn, I concur with HoagyM and Eileen on CAKING and CHARGE and share with the latter admiration for the &littish (imo) PUNDIT and HEDGEROW with its lovely (if oxymoronic) surface.

    I also thought SHRIMP was fun with a relevant surface, SPATULA was a neat anagram, ditto MOUSTACHE and HEARTY was succinct but perfect. I get HoagyM’s point about political pointscoring but I did enjoy TAKING THE PLUNGE (nuking the planet, Mark Pettigrew @10: brilliant).

    muffin @2: Movember is a global movement and charity.  It’s actually headquartered in Australia and I know the rugby fraternity have adopted it pretty much everywhere.  RIGHT HO was OK with me – my father used it – but I’d agree it’s dated.

    Thanks Matilda and loonapick

  20. muffin

    PostMark @19

    My gripe about RIGHT HO isn’t that it was wrong – it’s that the commoner “right oh” is only shown to be wrong by the crosser.

  21. poc

    Muffin@2: I agree on all points. Chambers has “Right-oh” and does not have “right ho”. I’m in the UK and had never heard of Movember, leaving the clue with an incomprehensible definition though otherwise gettable. Otherwise I liked the puzzle.

  22. Penfold

    [PostMark @19 Yes, I believe Movember originates from Australia, just below Merv Hughes’ nose.]

  23. tandemist

    I always enjoy a Matilda puzzle and this was no exception. A very pleasant start to the week.

  24. PostMark

    muffin @20: I’m sure I’ve seen it said here before that that’s what crossers are for.  (It was pointed out to me when I was one of those who ‘solved’ rani with hera in Friday’s Vlad).

    Penfold @22: when you have a nose like that, it’s worth underlining.

  25. mrpenney

    I was another who had RIGHT-OH at first, which delayed the MANGROVE for far longer than it should have.

    Muffin @2: I have a couple friends who do Movember here every year, so it certainly has reached Chicago at least.

    Surprised to see the late Tom Petty show up. I know music crosses the Atlantic more readily than many art forms, but Petty was pretty American as far as music goes, and a glance at the charts shows he was consistently a much bigger deal over here.

  26. sheffield hatter

    muffin @20. I agree with you, though I wouldn’t go so far as to call it a gripe. The setter is not obliged to use only the commoner instances of expressions! Like you, I was stuck on 12a and unable to think of a word with H_E as the last three letters, so changed OH to HO and MANGROVE soon appeared. I guess most people either solved 12a first or plumped for the right ending to 3d. C’est la vie!

    I think there’s a bit missing in the blog at 7d. The clue is “Chow chow chow”, and Loonapick has “DOG (“chow”) + FOOD (“chow”)”, but isn’t the dog called a chow chow? So it’s DOG (chow chow) + FOOD (chow), but to get DOG FOOD we have to look at the whole clue (reading it as chow for a chow chow, or a chow chow’s chow), which makes it an &lit, doesn’t it?

  27. PostMark

    muffin & sheffield hatter: I just checked and, of course, PG Wodehouse’s second novel Right Ho, Jeeves is why I’m thinking it’s a dated phrase.

  28. Julie in Australia

    I agree with those who liked Tom P(R)ETTY at 22a. [Loved all he did with the Heartbreakers but especially the Traveling (sic.) Wilburys. Thinking of “End of the Line’ as a potential funeral song – along with “Forever Young” (Julie = Young – in Mind and Heart at least).]

    [My son has done Movember with a ginge 6d MOUSTACHE, so I was cool with that one.]

    Thanks Matilda, especially for the fact that I didn’t need to look anything up, and to loonapick for the blog.

  29. TassieTim

    mrpenny @25. Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers are very well known in Australia. I’m certainly a fan. And he was a Traveling Wilbury, and had a big hit with Stevie Nicks. Certainly a global name.

  30. Ronald

    Enjoyed this gentle but agreeable solve. Good to see the much lamented Tom Petty (d. 2017) reappear. Tassie Tim @15, haven’t heard the expression “guernsey” before. Is it a bit of rhyming Cockney slang?

  31. Nixa

    Ah, I thought 12a had last letter of wander in Gove…

  32. Neill97

    I agree with sheffield hatter @26

  33. TassieTim

    [Ronald @30. It’s an Aussie phrase. A guernsey is a football jumper (cf jersey – another Channel Isle), so to get a guernsey is to be selected to play.]

  34. PostMark

    Nixa @31: very waggish!

  35. Michelle

    I liked PUNDIT.

    Thanks B+S

  36. Trailman

    I lightly inked in the second part of 3d with OH, sensing it might be HO and waiting for 12a to come to my aid. Seemed the sensible course.
    My only problem was writing the L of RELATION so badly I read it as a C when I came to solve 5d. Bit of a hold up till I realised!

  37. Octopus

    Just the ticket!

  38. Alphalpha

    Thanks to Matilda and loonapick.

    All has been said, but I have to pipe up in praise of PUNDIT just because it plays with the fact that “double entendre” means nothing to the average French person; as  I write it occurs to me that the term doesn’t quite equate with “pun” – although I wouldn’t like to be classified as a knocker on that count.

  39. Tony Santucci

    Thanks Matilda for a most enjoyable crossword. Favourites included PUNDIT (great surface), MANGROVE (another surface I liked), PRETTY, DEPLETE, and ENTRY for its simplicity. I agree this was on the easy side compared to puzzles of late but that doesn’t diminish its worth in my mind. Thanks Loonapick for the blog.

  40. Dan Milton

    In 7d the dog is the Chinese breed properly named chow-chow, although this is often shortened by half.

  41. Valentine

    15a — there are five letters in “at sea,” but only four removed from “shipmaster.”  We’re missing an A.

  42. Dave Ellison

    Sheffield hatter @ 26 And there was I about to comment how I liked 7d, a typical Paul type clue, and unusual in that it had the definition in the middle!

    However, I would go with loonapick’s interpretation, as I  am sure CHOW CHOW is often abbreviated to a CHOW

     

    Thanks loonapcick and Matilda for an enjoyable solve.

  43. Dave Ellison

    Valentine @ 41 The “missing” a is, as loonapick indicates, in the indefinite article before shipmaster; took me a while to see it, too

  44. muffin

    As Dave Ellison says, it’s the A. It caught my eye as it wouldn’t normally be included in the clue.

  45. Ronald

    In that case Tassie Tim@33 I’ll give his excellent album Hypnotic Eye a guernsey later today…

  46. Penfold

    [Tassie Tim@33 Guernsey jumpers were traditionally knitted by fishermen’s wives to keep their men warm at sea. Often called a gansie.]

  47. copmus

    In point of fact most of the Heartbreakers were better looking thanTom but he was the locomotive that pulled the train

    Rotary Hoe

  48. DaveinNCarolina

    I’m apparently in the minority here, but I thought the definition of HERETIC was fine. Heretics typically earn their names because of what they don’t believe, not what they do believe.

    Thanks to Matilda and loonapick.

  49. grantinfreo

    Same as for many others, nice Monday puzzle with similar comments: heretic as non-non-believer (tried atheist first), right-oh needing changing to -ho, and parochial surprise that Movember occurred any country else (I think we started it, not that I’d know anything at all except for the cricket pundits joshing about it). All good fun, thanks Matilda and loonapick.

  50. grantinfreo

    Oh yes of course, the inspiration being Merv Hughes’s mo… an iconic cultural contribution, not quite as subtle as the Mona Lisa’s smile, but hey…

  51. Tyngewick

    Thanks both,
    P(r)Etta good xword . Held up in the NE because I couldn’t believe the anagram could be so simple. Then, when I had the R, I wanted the cross to be a rood. I think of guernseys and jerseys as different. One has a round neck, the other a kind of slit.

  52. Penfold

    [Each guernsey/gansey had a unique pattern which varied from village to village and from family to family. If there was a shipwreck or accident the bodies washed up on the shore could be identified by their sweater as being from a particular village and family. The body could then be returned to their family for burial.]

  53. Nicholas

    Enjoyed the puzzle especially 15a and 20d but shouldn’t 21a read ‘gran’ irregularly or oddly? Thanks to all.

  54. Beobachterin

    Much enjoyed that too, even thugh I completed it in some wakeful periods in the night.  Completely agree on the heretic, who naturally would not think that s/he was anything other than an orthodox believer. Nicholas @ 53, regularly in crossword speak in my experience can mean either the even or the odd letters (and I think I have also seen it to mean every third letter of a longer word?).  Thank you to Matilda and loonapick!

  55. trishincharente

    [Likewise Penfold@13. Mine was a five month old JR. We were up at 05.00.]
    A very enjoyable puzzle I thought. Favourite was the delightful HEDGEROW which I thought quite elegant.
    9 across? Me – I’m saying nowt!
    Thanks to Matilda and loonapick.

  56. Petert

    For 25ac I thought it was JUKING (kin in Jug) missing the “almost”, and assuming that juking would be a slang term. HERETIC put me right. I think, from the perspective of true believer, a heretic is a non-believer so I was more or less ok with that, though I spent some time trying to get atheist to work

  57. Pauline in Brum

    Nothing much to add to what others have said. I thought the information from Penfold@52 was really interesting. Not a fan of cricket but that sure is some moustache! Great start to the week – thank you Matilda and Loonapick.

  58. Bill

    Really agree that it can be (relatively) easy, and still a good crossword, with some excellent surfaces. I’m ok with “heretic”. The clue doesn’t specify what s/he doesn’t believe. A heretic is somebody who doesn’t believe what the Church tells them to believe, so in 16th century England in Edward’s reign the Catholics  were heretics, in Mary’s reign the Protestants were. In both cases they suffered for their lack of belief in the prevailing orthodoxy. Thanks to Matilda and Loonapick.

  59. MarkN

    I parsed “Chow chow chow” the same as sheffield hatter @26. I know the dog by both names, but assumed the setter had gone with the better version (otherwise they could have used “Chow chow” to get an &lit anyway). But “chow chow chow” is more fun to read. I thought that clue epitomised the “not difficult but fun” aspect of this crossword.

    I did enjoy the Tom Petty clue, but (not particularly seriously) wonder if he is a heartbreaker. If it’s “Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers”, that suggests that he is something other. Otherwise they’d just be called the Heartbreakers.

    A very enjoyable Monday. Thanks all.

  60. BenT

    I’m always pleased to see Matilda’s name next to the crossword (if I’d realised earlier I’d have done it before the Quiptic) – all the polished surfaces that you hardened solvers get with the tougher kind of torturers, but without most of the difficulty so people like me get to play for a change! I always find she makes me laugh more than other setters, which is a decidedly good thing for a Monday.

    I’m agnostic about HERETIC, but less convinced by RELATION – I’m not going to complain about either though.

     

    Ta both.

  61. SPanza

    Very late to comment but I just wanted to say a big thank you to Matilda for a fine crossword with no words which were out of the ordinary.  If the only way to make a crossword last longer and appear harder is to include very obscure words like Pasquale and Puck do, I say more power to Matildas elbow.  I would love to grow a moustache for charity but as I already have a full and often overgrown beard that would require too much planning!!

    Thanks also to loonapick.  Btw I loved Eileen renaming you as loonalick……….

  62. SPanza

    Ben T @ 60 do we know Matilda is a she?  I did not think it had been revealed!  And, in this day and age don’t we have to wait until they self identify!!

  63. muffin

    [SPanza @62 – good point; Imogen, for example, is definitely a “he”.]

  64. OddOtter

    A light and fun Monday puzzle 🙂

    COTD: SHRIMP

    I agree with sheffield hatter & MarkN re 7d… seems much more clear and logical to me when read as a full &lit (or as I like to say, w=d, i.e. wordplay equals defn). Otherwise it forces a defn of chow as specifically *dog* food, which doesn’t make sense to me (or can someone find a ref that supports such specificity?).

    Don’t know if Movember is a thing here in the US, but have not heard of it myself (nor has my Google mobile keyboard, which keeps trying to correct it to November 🙂 )

    Thanks to our setter, blogger, and commenters!

  65. Simon S

    Matilda is definitely a she, who sets as Velia in the FT.

    I may be wrong on this, but I think she’s Mrs Philistine/Goliath. Certainly one of the female setters is.

  66. Monkey

    I suppose “Chow chow chow chow” would also have worked …

  67. BenT

    SPanza @62 – Very good point, and I do try not to make assumptions – in this case I was fairly sure as I’d seen female pronouns used (I think) in the Guardian’s crossword blog. I assumed they’d know! I’ve got a soft spot for Matilda as it’s the first name I found myself recognising, so would be mortified if I were getting pronouns wrong.

  68. Eileen

    Hi Simon S @65

    Re your second paragraph: I’d heard that rumour, too – seems very feasible to me, for several reasons. 😉

  69. Valentine

    Movember may be a global movement, but like many others it has passed by the US, or at least my part of it (apparently not mrpenney’s).

    I think it’s fine to refer to the dog as a chow, which is the name I’d seen for a good long time and thought was the regular name. To me “chow chow” is a condiment I remember from my childhood, describing itself as “mustard pickle,” and being a mustardy sauce with bits of pickled vegetables in.

    Julie@28 I think the one-l traveling is the American spelling, though I find myself using two l’s.   (Pardon my grocer’s apostrophe, I don’t know how else to pluralize a letter of the alphabet.)

  70. MaidenBartok

    [muffin @63 – MOVEMBER may be the giveaway.  But then again, I’m from Southend where that doesn’t always hold true…]

  71. hfowler

    Apologies for the lateness. I agree with loonapick and others about Matilda’s craftsmanship. To me, the issue is not how hard a puzzle may be, but rather how “fair” it is and how well it comports with long-established norms. Despite a couple of minor quibblets, her puzzles IMO are first rate. Nutmeg is usually more challenging and thus still my favorite, but Matilda is moving up fast. Thanks to one and all.

  72. Beobachterin

    I thought CHOW CHOW CHOW was brilliant too! (Forgot to say earlier.)

  73. sirtony

    [Re 25 Caking & getting hard. In 1991 there was a dispute as to whether VAT was chargeable on Jaffa Cakes which hung on whether these were cakes or biscuits. This resulted in a a famous definition of the difference which is that a cake starts soft and gets hard when stale whereas a biscuit starts hard and goes soft.]

     

     

  74. sheffield hatter

    I agree with MarkN @59 about the Tom Petty clue. I had the same wry thought when solving the clue: “…wonder if he is a heartbreaker.” [Was Gerry a Pacemaker? Was Wayne Fontana a Mindbender? Was Kilburn a High Road? Was Hatfield The North? Was Half Man a Biscuit? (Stop it, now.)] It was an excellent clue, as were so many in this super Monday offering.

    Got to agree also with OddOtter @64 for his/her their very logical support for my suggestion that 7d was &lit. “Otherwise it forces a defn of chow as specifically *dog* food.” And kudos too for the use of that superword ‘specificity’.

  75. Nila Palin

    SHRIMP: could a purist argue that “when not at sea” doesn’t grammatically say what it’s intended to mean?

    That’s before you get into the discussion about the letters of “at sea” not appearing in that order in “a shipmaster”, so do they need an anagram indicator?

  76. OddOtter

    Nola Palin, interesting comments re cluing for SHRIMP.

    I agree, “when not” isn’t ideal grammar for the wordplay; “but not” might be better, though at the expense of a clunkier surface. But it seems a modest quibblet that I willingly overlook since the meaning is so clear (and the surface so apt). And one might also read it more mathematically, e.g. “(the set X, Y), when not (the set X), yields (the set Y)”, which I think is ok.

    As for letter order I don’t see an issue… “not at sea” can be taken as “not a, t, s, e, a”, and thus as “first not a” (wherever a might occur in the fodder), “then not t” (again wherever it occurs), and so on, thus making order of the removed letters unimportant (whatever their order, they’re still all removed, one at a time, from the fodder).

  77. Greg

    As others have noted, Movember originated in Australia. I was actually surprised to see it feature in a UK crossword.

  78. Nila Palin

    Thanks, OddOtter @75. Neither of them are dealbreakers for me, but with the subtractive anagram, there has been the occasional debate about whether the removed letters need a separate anagram indicator if they don’t appear in that order in the larger anagram. Some setters use them, but it’s probably a minority.

  79. Van Winkle

    MarkN@59 and sheffield hatter @74 – the clue works without Tom Petty being a Heartbreaker, if you read it as “Heartbreaker-associated Tom”; in the same way that (eg) “Swordfishtrombones Tom” would give Waits even though (I think) he is neither a swordfish nor a trombone.

  80. sheffield hatter

    VW @79.  I think “Heartbreaker-associated Tom” was probably the solving process we all went through, even if subconsciously.  [I’m glad the clue wasn’t “Swordfishtrombones Tom”, as I’d never heard of that album!]

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