Guardian Cryptic 28,299 by Brummie

73 comments on “Guardian Cryptic 28,299 by Brummie”

1. Blue Note and Jam sound theme-ish, not that I’d know.

2. Thanks for setting out those last few parsings I had missed. A few too many “I suppose it has to be…” and not enough “now that is clever…” .

3. Not necessarily part of the theme but De Stijl was the second album by The White Stripes and Informer was a song by Snow.

4. I really enjoyed this with a few of my favourite bands here such as RADIOHEAD, THE JAM and even TRAFFIC from the past. I also spotted BLUE, SPLASH (Scottish showband) BLACK EYE(D) PEAS and I think EL DORADO is a festival of some sorts. Did anyone else keep searching for 6 letter clues with SIMPLE to go with MINDS. I thought FILTRATION, L-DOPA and WOOLLEN were neat clues. Ta Brummie for a lovely puzzle and manehi

5. Eldorado was an album by ELO…

6. A slow but steady solve for me, and I noticed the theme, for a change.  Liked FILTRATION and INSIGHTFUL. Took almost forever to get TRAFFIC. Many thanks to Brummie and manehi.

7. Great theme connecting original, 60s/70s Brit Rock and 90s Britpop think 80s missed out

   I liked seeing BLUE NOTE as it was an iconic jazz label-not a themer as such but a welcome guest.

   It was over a bit quickly but no less enjoyable as i had to get out of the door

    

   thanks all.

8. Thanks Brummie and manehi

   Hard, especially in the NW. Several unparsed, though I did see the theme.

   BLUE NOTE is a well-known jazz record label.

9. I tried and failed to find a Camus book entitled “Infamous”…

10. Brummie showing off Esoteric Knowledge? At least DE STIJL was possible to guess from the clue and the crosser JAM and some assumptions about Dutch spelling. TRAFFIC was just a protracted Google for something that would fit the clue and L-DOPA not much better.

    Clues for WHO and JAM were quite nice.

11. HEAD COLD gave me RADIO and PLAY. One of the few times that I spotted the theme early enough to help in completing the puzzle.

    Thanks Brummie and Manehi.

12. A G-threader reckoned 20 needed a ‘sounds like’, as the Tati film has one ‘f’ not two. [Pretty sure I’ve got a Traffic vinyl: “In the city, oh what a pity, I could be in Berkshire where the poppies grow so high..” Is that Winwood?..it’s all in memory-bits].

    Oh yes, the Jam and, d’oh, the Who, as Manehi has added.

    And thought Ponticello (for which I needed some guess and check) must be a Rialto or a Vecchio that I’d missed. No idea of it as violin part, despite having been a young fiddler.

    All in all, a scrappy solve, me, not the setter. Thanks B and M.

13. A significantly more difficult and lengthy solve than of late, but I can’t say I really enjoyed it. Actually most clues had to be wrestled to death, rather than solved. WOOLLEN raised a smile of satisfaction but not much else. Several answers were new-to-me and and needed subsequent research and confirmation, such as PONTICELLO – and last-one-in, BLUE NOTE. I suppose I was simply not on the setter’s wavelength, as the saying goes.

14. Thanks, manehi. As so often, I share your favourites, with the addition of POLICE and FILTRATION.

    I enjoyed this. I’d never heard of the Dutch style but managed to work it out. I was quite chuffed that I actually recognised ten bands (and enjoyed spotting the combinations – ROLLING STONES, RADIOHEAD, COLDPLAY). I’m sure there are more but I couldn’t be bothered to research – just about anything can be the name of a band somewhere.

    Many thanks to Brummie for a fun puzzle.

     

15. Tough but very enjoyable puzzle today.  Slightly narked about TRAFFIC as I dislike the way that distributors insist on “translating” original film titles.  It is still a good film though, as is Mon Oncle which is an abject warning on our over-technological present…

    DE STIJL was a write-in – it has crossed into “classical” music in works by people such as Louis Andriessen (“De Stijl,” “M is for Man, Music, Mozart”) and our own rather wonderful Michael Nyman (and the late, much-missed Steve Martland).  It’s a fascinating style which owes much to heavily amplified rock music.  PONTICELLO another write-in.

    Quite a few needed help today, so a DNF but not without enjoyment.

    Many thanks Brummie and manehi!

16. pity 18a isn’t COUNCIL (for Paul Weller fans). Interesting gridfill…L-Dopa eh? Hmmm

17. A DNF for us today because of a careless WOOLIES at 18a 🙁

    cobro noticed the theme and that definitely helped with getting a few.

    Favourites were SPLASH and FILTRATION, I thought the surfaces were very good.

    Thanks Brummie and manehi!

18. On further thought, there was quite a lot to enjoy, so if Brummie reads this I hope he will forgive my grumble at his Crossword this morning @10. Several clues took me a lot of work but answers were clearly correct, such as BLUE NOTE and FILTRATION (flirtation?; can’t be; filtration? how is that “straining“?; penny drop). WAFFLE raised a smile, though it’s the last thing I’d choose.

19. ‘Black’ aka Colin Vearncombe had a hit single ‘Wonderful Life’ in 1986 pop pickers.  Not ‘alf!

20. Found this puzzle hard to get started on, but there was plenty to like about the clues that I did solve easily. The more I progressed, the more it seemed like a puzzle by Pasquale with new words plus some obscure GK.

    Favourites were HEAD COLD, INSIGHTFUL, RADIO, DE STIJL, WOOLLEN, FAMOUS

    Learnt a new saying: jam tomorrow = a pleasant thing which is often promised but rarely materializes.
    Also new: TRAFFIC = film by Jacques Tati; EYEBLACK (old-fashioned term for mascara); PONTICELLO; POLICE runner = A police officer of the lowest rank.

    Failed L-DOPA (never heard of it).

21. [L-DOPA by Big Black was No 42 in John Peel’s Festive 50 for 1987.]

22. Monkey is right with both posts. Some really good clues but an otherwise excellent crossword spoiled for me by the need for SIX Googles to confirm answers.

    My usual gripe – there is a thin line between extending GK and cake-walking.

23. This promised to be tricky at first and it took a while for something to drop but a steady and complete solve.  I was delighted to get several dnk’s from the wordplay with a google to confirm the answer: DE STIJL, PONTICELLO, EYEBLACK, NONARY, BLUE NOTE and L-DOPA.  The criticisms of TRAFFIC may be fair but I’m pleased to be reminded of a delightful film. ( MB@15: I’d also commend Jour de Fete.)  And the band is one of my favourites.  Missed the theme though (doh!) which is a shame as some of this is my era.  A further tangential reference might be Blackest Eyes by Porcupine Tree, a British prog rock band active between 1987 and 2009, and a super track.

    Some delightful clueing in here today: INFORMER is an excellent misdirect, INSIGHTFUL has a topical and very smooth surface, RADIO is similarly smooth, I enjoyed the definition and wordplay for FAMOUS, the misdirectional use of remit to mean pay in PLAY and the halved/IN TWO device.  COTD was POLICE, again for the misleading definition.  Really nice to find myself completely on Brummie’s wavelength today.

    muffin @8: the NW corner was definitely the trickiest and was last to fill – apart from 3d where I had wondered whether to enter muffin!  A google search of muffin + rabbit, however, was frustrating leading, as it did, to site after site about decorating cakes for Easter!

    Thanks Brummie & manehi

24. Oofyprosser @22: whilst I take your point, and had the same number of dnk’s, there is some pleasure to be had in using Google to confirm the answers.  Less pleasure (as per my muffin attempt) in seeking a solution via the web.  Your post at least suggests you got it the right way round.

25. Have to admit that I was held up at the end for some time by the interlocking HEAD COLD and BLUE NOTE. First one in was BLUR, so thought this might be yet another puzzle dedicated to that band’s output. Rushed in On The Fence impetuously for 13d, so that held things up in the SE corner for a while. Wasn’t really my cup of tea this morning, even with the waffle, I’m afraid…

26. PostMark et al

    Yes, HEAD COLD was my LOI too, but it became my favourite.

    Do you really eat muffins for breakfast? More of a tea thing round here.

27. I spent some time trying to make HOLLIES fit 18a. LOI was PLAY.

    Great fun. Thanks Brummie and thanks to manehi for the blog.

28. Started off well but then had to wrestle the remaining half. Did like HEAD COLD, FAMOUS and POLICE in particular and enjoyed the band spotting. TRAFFIC was courtesy of google but worked out DE STIJL which was satisfying as was new to me.
    I am not so sure about reducibg Parkinson’s disease to shaking but I guess that is probably its most well-known symptom.
    Thanks to Brummie and Manehi

29. Michelle @19 – Jam yesterday, jam tomorrow but never jam today – Alice in Wonderland?

30. I always seem to find Brummie harder work than it should be, with clues often being obvious in hindsight, but a bit of a BLUR when I stare at the puzzle. Still it’s very pleasant when the penny drops. King’s mistress must be Nell Gwynn, I think, but there can’t be a word with LLEN in it can there? Oh, yes. Now I get it…

31. SinCam @39 Through the Looking Glass, I believe.

    [Also Billy Bragg The Home Front

    The constant promise of jam tomorrow
    Is the New Breed’s litany and verse
    If it takes another war to fill the churches of England
    Then the world the meek inherit, what will it be worth.]

32. [You sometimes see the same sentiment on carved wooden notices in pubs:

    “Free beer tomorrow”]

33. Postmark @23; I made the NW corner unnecessarily difficult for myself by actually entering ‘muffin’, Chambers having helpfully informed me that both ‘muffin’ and ‘rabbit’ were words for someone bad at ball games. Never having eaten a waffle for breakfast, it took me a long time struggling with other clues to decide it must be wrong. Very much enjoyed this (my personal knowledge covers the earlier period, while I had a teenage son who saw it as his duty to educate me in BritPop – both bring back happy memories), so thanks to Brummie. As Postmark says @24, googling to confirm that something is right that you’ve worked out is quite different from googling to find out what the answer might be, and really rather satisfying.

34. (News)CAST are also a band, though their presence is probably accidental.

35. Sarah @33: that’s funny.  But I can see your thinking (I think): if a bowler might ‘have someone for breakfast’, then it’s likely to be a poor batsman which would be a rabbit – though I didn’t know of muffin in that context.  And, yes, when I started to type in LDO and Google suggested L-DOPA there was a definite smile of satisfaction, as with the others.  (Mind you, there have been plenty of occasions when I’ve typed in my possible solution only to find no such term exists and Google responds with an “Are you mad?”)

36. L-DOPA was my FOI. I think if we scientists are supposed to know everything about Shakespeare’s plays and literature, it’s not unreasonable that some people should learn some science/medicine.

    I enjoyed the clues for PONTICELLO, INFORMER, and also the simple SPLASH. I missed the theme, not really looking for one.

    Thanks Brummie and manehi.

37. I fear my awareness of L-Dopa derives entirely from the film Awakenings, rather than any scientific background

38. L-Dopa is a song by US noise merchants Big Black.

39. This was one of those rare occasions where I spotted the theme in time for it to be of some help.  Having got RADIO and PLAY I realised I needed HEAD and COLD, and where could they go apart from 10, 2?  It was nice that the theme was hinted at in the surface of the first clue, and in a couple of others (eg 21a, 26a).

    In 14a I’m not sure that CAST by itself means “rejected” – I think it would have to be in conjunction with, say, “off” or “aside”.  But that’s a minor point and this was a very enjoyable puzzle.

    [muffin @32: I rather liked a sign I saw outside a York pub a while back saying “Soup of the day – beer”.]

    Many thanks Brummie and manehi.

40. L-Dopa is mentioned in Will Self’s “Umbrella”

41. Lord Jim @39: cast skins of eg insects or lizards?  Those tend to be described as cast rather than (or perhaps as well as) cast off.

42. Did you ever have the feeling when reading a professional book or movie critic making the most contrived explanation of a plot point that maybe the writer never meant that, and maybe it was just a coincidence?   Well I got all the band names in this puzzle, but on seeing all the song titles others above have suggested are part of the theme too, I wondered what the base rate is of unintentional song titles in G cryptic grids.  I didn’t have time to do a thorough test, but from random sampling from last week I got the rate of 48%.  Apparently, people write songs about anything and everyfhing.

43. [Dr WhatsOn

    You’ve reminded me of the story of Howard Hawks filming Raymond Chandler’s The Big Sleep. They had got to the bit where the chauffeur is found floating in the harbour, dead. Hawks rang Chandler to ask who had killed him.

    “I’ll get back to you” said Chandler.

    An hour later he phoned back. “I haven’t the slightest idea” he said.]

44. CAST and BLACK are in there too

45. Managed, as others have noted, to get quite a few answers from the wordplay before (confidently) checking their existence on Google. Impressed by those for whom L-DOPA was foi, or PONTICELLO a write-in. And chapeau to copmus @7 for getting it over a bit too quickly. Wow!

    I had doubts about WOOLLEN, though the wordplay was clear; to me, “warm wear” would be woollenS. Doubts about TRAFIC with an extra F, the cryptic definition of POLICE and the “staggeringly wealthy?” ROLLING STONES would have been quickly removed by checking for a theme. Last one in, after a quick glance at the blog had given me the initial letter, was NEWSCAST – I really couldn’t see Virgin=NEW, but that’s just me, I guess. Not ashamed to admit to a DNF, as this still looks to me, even in retrospect, a really difficult crossword.

    I nearly always read the questionnaire in the Guardian Weekend magazine, where a celebrity (defn: someone I’ve barely heard of) is asked questions like “what is your greatest achievement?”, and “what would your superpower be?” My greatest achievement today was solving BLUE NOTE; my superpower (please, supreme being, if you’re listening) would be to solve clues like that in less than 15 minutes.

46. Dr. WhatsOn @42. “48% base rate of unintentional song titles in Guardian cryptic grids.” You really do have a lot of time on your hands, don’t you. 😉

47. [muffin @43 and Dr WhatsOn @42: it’s nearly 40 years since I read Tolkien’s Letters but I’m sure I recall he didn’t really know where the hobbits were heading or just who Aragorn was until he had written his tale as far as the Inn at Bree.  At which point he stopped, was – I think – stymied for a while, and then revised what he had written in the light of the whole saga that had become clear to him.  Which will mean nothing to those unfamiliar to LOTR but might be of interest to those who have.]

48. [Interesting, PostMark. I’ve always felt that the Old Forest, Tom Bombadil, and the barrow-wights didn’t really fit in with the rest of the story. Didn’t Peter Jackson miss these episodes out of the film?]

49. muffin@26  Over here, a very popular breakfast food is “English muffins,” which I now know (thanks, Mr Google) are not English at all but which were originated in New York City in the 1880s by Samuel Bath Thomas, and you can still buy Thomas’s English Muffins today.  They are crumpet-like, but leavened with yeast rather than baking soda and a bit stiffer and drier.  You separate the two halves and toast them, then put butter (delicious in the little holes) or jam on, or make Eggs Benedict, a popular brunch dish of a poached egg over Canadian bacon on an English muffin.  Restaurants often offer English muffins instead of toast for a small extra charge.

    Muffins, though, without the national label, are totally different.  They’re a baking soda batter and you bake them in muffin tins (or pans); they are round and narrower at the bottom than the top and often overflow the cup-like container for a widened edge.  They can be savory but are most often sweet.  Blueberry muffins are a classic, but there are also bran, corn, chocolate chip, banana nut, and anything else you might care to add.  I don’t know if they have cousins if the UK.  If they have, they must have a different name, since “muffins” already means something different.

50. [Valentine @4T9

    he second sort of muffin is the one behind the “muffin top” profie description, for someone whose belly overflows their belt.]

51. [Sh@46 not really.  You can test several titles a minute by googling “xyz lyrics”]

52. I also found this hard but packed with less satisfaction than some commentators here.

    [I read yesterday’s full thread rather late so I will comment here. I tend to agree with you, Van Winkle, although your tone was a trifle harsh.  I do not think there should be threads or like buttons, but merely that some posters here (you know who you are) should be just a shade more disciplined.  Don’t forget that not long ago Gaufrid asked us all to adhere to certain norms to prevent the discussions getting too long and wandering way off topic.  We are now back again, albeit with a few name changes, to a similar situation as we had then.  Is it really necessary to post 12 to 15 times, as some do, often with a fair degree of repetition.

    Thanks to Brummie and  manehi

53. Foiled by the trio 19, 20 and 28 as a result of a knowledge deficit in the fields of French cinema and obsolete make-up.  The theme jumped out at me after BLUR went in, with PULP already in the SE.  I also went in search of SIMPLE, and MOTT THE too for that matter!

    In the realm of ridiculous connections, BLUE NOTE was one of the winning horses in the movie The Sting, who is, of course, one of the founding members of the POLICE.  Just saying 🙂 .

    Thanks, Brum and manehi

54. Getting in late today, so I doubt many will read this. However, I wanted to raise a couple of quibbles I had to see if others agree.

    ROLLING for staggeringly seems wrong? Staggering, yes maybe. But not staggeringly. I know the term rolling in it for wealthy but have never heard it shortened to just ROLLING. But I make the assumption the usage is known and fair.

    WOOLLEN for warm wear – surely it should be woollens? Warm wear can be made of wool and so they are woollen by extension. But you’d never say I’m going to pull on a WOOLLEN would you?

    I’m probably confused or overthinking this. It’s been a long day.

55. A lovely solve, managed to parse it all and I got the theme – a first for me with Brummie. [So far I’ve gone with two out of three ain’t bad… on the solving front]. I am in no doubt that I have this website and lockdown to thank for my improved performance.  Impressed by the number of potential additions to the theme which feature in the thread.

    PONTICELLO a new one for me. FOI was L-DOPA, and favourite was INSIGHTFUL.  Thanks to Brummie for a brilliant puzzle, manehi for the blog and the rest of you for an (as always) interesting and informative read.

56. [sheffield hatter @45: I once went on holiday to France with a group of people, one of whom had what is best described as a strong “Estuary English” accent (and no French).  At a meal, the waiter asked “is there anything else you’d like?” – she replied “Nothin'” and was presented a few moments later with a rather delightful Chocolate Muffin.]

57. keyser soze @54. If you look at my post @45 you’ll see that I agree with you about woollenS. You would have to be a mind reader to know whether I also agree with your point about ROLLING. The fact that I failed to solve this clue might be a hint…

58. Maybe I haven’t looked in the right places, but I can’t find dictionary support for the definition of NONARY (22dn). It’s generally listed as an adjective, and the one time I found it defined as a noun the meaning was different (a digit, not a group).

     

59. Rather BLURry today, like adjusting the RADIO yet always tuned off center; ultimately left feeling rather flat, with a seventh or so unsolved… the result of various obscurisms, Britishisms, and (to me) straining of defns/grammar. Was deaf to the main theme, only witnessing an apparent crime/reporting mini-theme (no help w/solving). But did get L-DOPA (FOI to boot), in part fr/Big Black (as Penfold highlighted)… they were moderately known in indie/underground circles during college days… even saw them live once.

    Oh well, hope to be more in tune tomorrow… and regardless of today’s TRAFFIC JAM, thx to setter, blogger, and commenters.

60. Ted, re NONARY: Perhaps defn should just be “of 9″, w/”other group” as (somewhat cumbersome) anagrind?

    Re WOOLLEN, had similar concerns, but see in lexico/Chambers that while “often/usually” plural, singular is valid.

61. Ted @58  Try this (British English section).

62. On the same day that Hob (in the Independent, aka Puck in this place) took us to the other end of the musical spectrum, Brummie came up with something we very much enjoyed.
    The theme was quickly cracked and it helped (for example with the four 4-letter words).
    I was surprised to see that my solving partner, who is not into pop music at all, counted 9 bands where I got stuck on 8! [which is not 8-factorial, by the way]

    As someone who spent the first 80% of his life in The Netherlands, I would like to say something about 16ac.
    Many pupils at a Dutch secondary school will probably have heard of the art movement.
    The solution (DE STIJL) means literally ‘the style’, so the definition was not really very cryptic.
    The thing is that in a Dutch crossword the enumeration would have been (2,4).
    IJ is in The Netherlands a single character, considered to be a vowel and one difficult to pronounce for a Brit.
    And so, for me, seeing the I and the J separated from each other looks really odd.
    Of course, I see why Brummie used (2,5) – the IJ (lower case ij, often when handwritten seen as one symbol) is not part of the English alphabet.

    Very nice crossword, we thought.

    Ted @58, re NONARY, have a look in Collins or the SOED.
    Many thanks to manehi & Brummie.

63. Enjoyed this, despite not seeing the theme and struggling to parse several, though I now wonder why… I got DE STIJL from knowing the Dutch for style. Sil, historically the letter Y comes from precisely that IJ dipthong (ij = y). Thanks to Brummie and manehi.

64. PS I was early to the crossword and then late to the blog.

65. Re NONARY: Interesting that “group of nine” is listed, under British english, in Collins (and per Sil, in SOED too, tho unable to confirm that myself)… but not in lexico nor online Chambers nor dead tree Chambers circa early 80’s. Can anyone with access to the very latest unabridged Chambers check there?

66. [Sil @62 Presumably the Dutch version would also have included Golden Earring and Focus]

67. [Sil @62:  Thanks for solving the mystery of why IJsselmeer is spelt in that (to British eyes) peculiar fashion!

    On the subject of Dutch sounds that are difficult for Brits to pronounce, the one that really has me stymied is the ui in huis (or indeed Zuiderzee, which I gather was the IJsselmeer’s precursor?).  When I was a student a Dutch friend attempted to put me right, and I tried all sorts of variants between English house and German Haus, but none would satisfy her exacting standards!]

    [Beobachterin @63, I thought our letter y comes from the Greek upsilon (upper case Y)?]

68. I am amazed nobody mentioned my faut pas 14a …… entering NEWSREEL (REAL) with some certainty.

    I know there is no ‘sounds like’ hint, but it seemed to fit so well.

    This one was difficult for me compared to other Brummie puzzles.

69. Postman arrived with new mouse. Delighted it has a on/off switch!  I get so cheesed when I put the computer to sleep , put it on the floor and the mouse wakes it up again!

     

    Just looked at the solutions which looked so unfamiliar!

    Loaded the puzzle and I had simply given with only half done.

    I guess Brummie is no longer my favourite :O(

70. When I was eight, my parents took me on a European vacation, and we crossed with the Holland-America Line aboard the Zuiderkruis (Southern Cross).  I learned the pronunciation of that diphthong then, being a child and o language-learning mode, as well as having a father who had a good phonetic ear.  I think I’ve still got it right.  A Dutchman I met later said, “If you want to hear it pronounced right, ask a Virginian.”  Apparently it’s a part of that region’s accent.

71. “of language-learning age,” I meant.

72. Thanks phitonelly and Sil for the citations for NONARY. I looked in Chambers but not Collins.

     

73. My understanding of ‘eyeblack’is it’s the black stripe under the eyes used by American footballers. Supposedly assists against glare. So functional make-up.

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