Guardian Cryptic 28,635 by Paul

85 comments on “Guardian Cryptic 28,635 by Paul”

1. Not a great crossword if you are (a) not a Pom and/or (b) not very interested in soccer. I got GROUND and (via HOAX) suspected AMEX – so then I had to go searching if there was a Amex Ground/Oval/Arena/etc – and hit gold with Stadium. I could only bring to mind two soccer grounds in England – fortunately, both STAMFORD BRIDGE and ANFIELD turned up. It is a bit rough when some of the names turned out to be not the ground’s proper name but the sponsor’s. Having said that, I did work my way through and enjoyed a good deal of this, particularly in the non themed clues – SORDID, ADORING, HEIGHTEN, PER DIEM, OP ARTIST – and I didn’t have to do too much searching of lists of soccer grounds (but who knew there was a LONDON STADIUM? – not me). Why does ‘punch’ = left hander? Thanks, Paul and manehi.

2. TassieTim @1 I am left assuming that it is supposed to be well known that Punch as in Punch and Judy is a left hander.

   The first player I found for 22d was “lutist” which I got from ThoU = old you, which nearly works. YouR is of course more obvious and correct!

3. Knew Etihad (we have one in Oz) and Emirates (bro-in-law’s a Gooner), but not really my field, so a bit of a plod with a bit of guess and check. Bully as anagrind is innovative …. new? All good, ta both.

4. @1 Tassie Tim, I’m in the same hemisphere as you but a Pom from way back but I still had to look up AMEX and a couple of others. Favourite was ADORING for the sphincter, two words which sum up my attachment to the team that plays at Deepdale.

5. a left-hander is a strike with the left hand – will update the blog to clarify

6. Left-hander is a punch in eg Boxing

7. TassieTim @1, as a Pommie football fan I sympathise. Right in my comfort zone, but I did wonder how fair it was to a wider audience. I think it works so long as the theme itself is identifiable and possible solutions can readily be found in a list somewhere. I remember a bank holiday one recently which was themed around the Ring Cycle, about which I know very little but Wikipedia came to my aid. I suspect today’s offering will divide opinion somewhat, but right it was right into the slot for me.

8. Thanks Paul and manehi
   Another example of a puzzle that was probably more fun to set than solve. Some ridiculous surfaces (what is 7,24 supposed to mean?) and a theme that doesn’t interest me.
   I got in through FOI ETIHAD and guessed GROUND, then thought “oh dear”.
   I did like STAMFORD BRIDGE.

9. Not a quick one for me at all – I had my usual struggle with Paul’s puzzles, but I enjoy the tussle. Fortunately got the theme early on, but still had to work hard. Liked OP ARTIST, UPSTAIRS and RUHR. Thanks to P & m.

10. Enjoyed this but, knowing zip about footie, (the only game played with the outside of the head) had to Google a list of grounds.

    Many thanks both.

11. Got the idea from Amex, had to be stadiums or credit cards! Second one in, my beloved ‘Carra Rud’, then I was off to a fairly quick solve. (I used to know all the grounds before corporate naming came in.) Thanks to Paul for remembering us, and to manehi for the blog.

12. This was challenging but I really liked it. It was satisfying to solve, even though I had to google some of the football grounds. I frequently don’t know the topic that well and have to use resources. I have an old book of Araucaria’s puzzles and he says in the introduction (pre-google) that he expects solvers to use reference books. There was a lovely precision in clueing. I liked the use of 12 in a different way in 22 across / 19 and player in a different context in 22 down. It can’t be easy to think up themes year upon year and it seems clever to me to have fitted in so many answers on the theme.

13. Started off quickly and then GROUND to a halt. I was expecting more variety in the interpretation of “ground”. I thought POETRY was very good, though.

14. manehi @5. I realised that the left hand can be used to punch (as can the right), but I am still puzzled at the equation of the two. I was fortunate that searching for Amex Stadium gave me the (surely obscure) Brighton ground, as the Wikipedia list doesn’t call it that at all. It calls it Falmer, and gives the commercial name as The American Express Community Stadium.

15. Thanks manehi, got into the theme early thanks to ETIHAD and it went well from there although I think ANFIELD took me as long as the rest put together. I did struggle a while with LEFT HANDER as I tend to think of someone throwing a LEFT or catching his opponent with the LEFT HAND rather than that phrase in full. A shame these days that a list of big grounds is almost a list of multinational corporations, but I enjoyed this with POETRY and HEIGHTEN my favourites – Thanks Paul.

16. muffin @8 “probably more fun to set than solve” is spot on.

17. Surprised to find I knew all the GROUNDS, (ETIHAD being the way in), even though in many cases Paul has chosen newer and less familiar sponsor-inspired names, but I think some of the non-UK solvers may have trouble.
    Enjoyed STAMFORD BRIDGE and POETRY.

18. Well I loved this one. I got ETIHAD right off the bat, so the theme could only be airlines or football grounds, and then after AMEX only the latter. (Not bad for a Statesider, right?) At that point I started conjecturing more possible theme answers, some of which were actually present. At one point after a couple of crossers for 22,19 I was thinking, how can it be LONDON STADIUM, West Ham are not in the Midlands, but then I read the whole clue again. Duh!

    I really liked the surface for UNDERSTUDY (despite the violent nature of it).

19. In my comfort zone as a footie fan and AMEX was my starter for ten. I liked STAMFORD BRIDGE, ADORING and POETRY but disappointed not to see my beloved Loftus Road (never heard of it, I hear you exclaim). Anyway probably a turn-off for some solvers but everything was clued fairly.

    Ta Paul & manehi.

20. muffin @8: re nonsense surfaces; couldn’t agree more. I seem to have abandoned my 1-man crusade for coherent surfaces with Paul…started to sound like a cracked record.

21. Early on, it looked like 7d was “carrow road”, but dismissed it as there’s no such thing as a carrow road (narrow road, yes, but carrow?). Running out of root vegetables I moved on. 9a I could construct “etihad” but that was obviously wrong – it’s not even a word. We got there in the end, but it felt like a slog. Despite being British, not being a footie fan, I’d only heard of two of the grounds.

22. FOI was AMEX, but knowing nothing of football did not intuit the right theme. Just not on the right wavelength today.

23. I really liked this (and I’m definitely a Paul fan anyway). Got the theme pretty quickly and knowing them obviously helped.

    Outside the theme I thought UNDERSTUDY was superb.

    And producing that anagram for LONDON STADIUM was a stroke of genius and misdirection.

    Thanks to Paul and manehi

24. As with Muffin@8 and Dr WhatsOn@18 – after staring unsuccessfully at this for a while – got into it with ETIHAD and its ubiquitous ET for the film required . Thereafter a nice swift filling in of the grid. Sympathy for those with no interest or knowledge of some of the English Premier League soccer venues. Personally I enjoyed this, though understand if there are quibbles elsewhere. Some I couldn’t precisely parse, but never mind. Thanks to Paul and Manehi this morning…

25. Thanks for the blog, got Stamford Bridge straight away and thought it was going to be battles but sadly not. Fortunately the clues all worked well enough to cope while ignoring the football. Spent a long time thinking about the full stop for 22.19 but it must be a misprint. PER DIEM was nice with the PERM and OP ARTIST and CISTERCIAN were nice to work out.

    AlanC even I know it is Queens Park Rangers and for some reason they play in rugby shirts.

26. Had to resort to a list of football grounds..who’d believe Crewe Alexandra is in League Division one!!!!(my old stomping ground in my teenage years, it was all there was to do in Crewe) Totally misled by 22,19, thought Paul must have got his geography wrong. Defeated by 1 down completely.

27. Anyone else for MARROW ROAD? (yes, I know, gardening’s not my thing either 😉 ) Glad I wasn’t expected to know where Feyenoord play.

    EMIRATES was the kind of indirect anagram that seems to be gaining a foothold – I wish it wasn’t, as I suspect this device will open the door to others (say = EG, city = LA/NY/EC?) and the sheer number of permutations will eventually become off-putting.

    How about ‘Drunken sailor with Geordie superior gives signal (6)’?

    I did like PER DIEM (for the surface), and being reminded of Bridget Riley with OP ARTIST (despite the surface).

    Is no one going to provide a musical link for 21d? Oh all right, I will.

    Thanks Paul and manehi.

28. Now that made me chuckle Roz @25.

29. [ I was told stripes for football and hoops for rugby ? ]

30. I liked PER DIEM, and usually I like Paul. Not today. I don’t mind this sort of themed puzzle, but a football ignoramus like me really needed the theme clue at 12 to be slightly less obtuse. It’s a nice enough clue, but if your head sets off in the wrong direction as mine did, then the whole puzzle is a slog. Hey ho – thanks to Paul and to manehi for the blog for the ones I lost the will to parse.

31. Thanks for the blog.

    Not exactly “a quick solve” here. Got AMEX, nho the stadium, thought banks/credit cards/types of plastic, maybe. ETIHAD is also a bank, so completely lost off-piste. Got there in the end when I constructed CARRO(T)WROAD, nho either, and googling it ….

32. Roz@25, die hard fans of Scottish giants Celtic would be horrified to hear their shirts described as belonging to the rugby code. In the early Sixties I used to support my local amateur side, Kingstonian. They used to play in horizontal red stripes. But definitely the exception to most team kits then..

33. [ Ronald @32 I have no actual knowledge here and clearly my sources are not to be trusted. Do any rugby teams play in stripes ? ]

34. Decided ‘Midlands’ had to be N (the middle of ‘lands’, and the last letter of London), which made that parse quite tricky… And managed to snooker myself by bunging in AT COURSE early on, figuring it’d click later.

    NHO 20A or 6D, but I know my football so for once the theme was a blessing.

    Thanks Paul, and manehi

35. Ronald @ 32: I used to play against Kingstonian for the Met Police in the Eighties, when they were at the lovely Kingsmeadow ground. Eb @ 27: that dancing made me chuckle and I’m still trying to work out what football shirts they’re wearing. I have Derby, Fulham and Algeria so far 🙂

36. Tassie Tim @14 – “he got caught with a left-hander” is used commonly enough, where left-hander definitely means a punch. The usual context is boxing reports though, so unless you read the sports pages you might not see it that often.

    As for today’s puzzle, as ever with themes it’s going to immediately divide those who got it (and knew at least some grounds) and those who didn’t, plus I get the impression Paul’s style is quite Marmite anyway. Unusually for a Paul theme I didn’t have to back into the theme word from solved clues, getting GROUND more or less instantly, and it got quicker once I suspected it was at least limited to Premier League ones. Can see how it would have been a disappointing solve for many others though.

37. New for me: CARROW ROAD, STAMFORD ROAD, AMEX Stadium, LONDON STADIUM, EMIRATES stadium.

    Gave up on 15ac and 17ac (never heard of it).

    I did not parse 21d, 12ac GROUND = GO?

    Thanks, both.

38. Thanks Paul and manehi. I enjoyed this one. Thought the gateway, 12a, was pretty neat: even after I realised that it must be GROUND, it still took some head-scratching to work out the parsing. LOI was 22,19; “splash” as anagrind was new to me.

39. Being “ow you say-a dot com”-and a football fan-the theme should have been up my strasse but I am getting a bit tired of Paul puzzles hinging largely on one clue.
    I’ve been to Carrow Road, Maine Road, Highbury, White Hart Lane-if you follow my drift this makes the theme somewhat obnoxious
    Who is going to buy Norwich apart from Alan Partridge.

40. We don’t want anyone to buy us and give us a stupid name! Agree with Copmus @39, I like the traditional names. Don’t like football but learnt names of grounds when boys were small. Enjoyed the puzzle – first in 21d, then Stamford Bridge, which gave the theme.

41. Thanks Paul & manehi.

    At 17ac, is ‘N’ an accepted term for an unknown number? In my crossword solving experience an unknown is normally X, Y or Z. My dictionary defines ‘N’ as ‘the total number of individuals or observations in the sample’.

42. AMEX and COAX popped out immediately, followed by ETIHAD and GROUND, after which it was all relatively plain sailing for me. Despite not being a true tifoso myself (though hereditarily 17ac), like Bonnie @40 I have a son who is, so the stadia were familiar names.

    I enjoyed PER DIEM and POETRY and the unexpected anagram for LONDON STADIUM.

    Nice constructions, pity about the surfaces….

    Thanks to S&B

43. Good to hear how very very clever manehi is, I’m sure it’s encouraging to beginners

44. Loved this Football Stadium themed puzzle from start to finish, [Lifelong Gooner] Paul at his best – full of wit, challenge and misdirection. Too many ticks to mention them all but especially liked 11ac, 24ac, 5dn, and especially RUHR, if only for the sound of coinage dropping from a great height. Thanks to Paul and manehi for the blog.

45. Dantheman @41 in school maths, n is often used as the default ‘unknown’ in a problem that has an integer (whole number) solution. In other equations x would be the default unknown. I think n x y z have all been in common use in crosswords for a while.

46. dantheman@41: Following GaryBaum@45, as well as your statistical example, I usually think of N or n representing some unspecified number eg in a formula such as
    the sum of the first n positive integers = (1/2).n.(n+1)
    rather than a particular unknown one in an equation that must be found, BUT do recall problems along the lines of “Find n such that …” (with n used more often than other letters, I think, or anything from a to z could be an unknown number), so I can’t really call it unfair, just misleading maybe (which is all part of the fun), but that is one of the reasons I took a long time to solve that one!

47. [peter & ant 43: some helpful hints ]

48. Thanks both,
    Muffin @8 I don’t have much problem with ‘ground shifting under root vegetable’. It might easily be caused by moles. No more unlikely than many a surface. I find it’s part of the fun thinking of scenarios that might give rise to the surface of a clue. I’m off to the allotment to shift the ground under some spuds just now, come to think of it.

49. Paul is by some way my least favourite compiler and today’s puzzle exhibits all his weaknesses.
    1. It wouldn’t be Paul without some anal/lavatorial/ excretory giggle, would it?
    2. Nothing against themes but Brighton and Hove football stadium?
    3. The key clue is pretty feeble. G+ circle. Anyway ground and dirt aren’t synonyms.
    4. As usual with Paul you have to get the cross references from a single clue to make sense.

50. Got EMIRATES by crossers and the anagram, worked out GROUND (again, praise for not having any themed answers crossing the answer that gives the theme!), was baffled at the connection, realized 7, 24 was something W ROAD, thought “Underground stops maybe?”, then came up with CARROT and looked up CARROW Road. Used a list for a lot of the rest, though AMEX and ETIHAD came from the wordplay. The LONDON STADIUM anagram was very nice.

    Anyway, not the easiest one for a Yank.

    In the spirit of reciprocation, or perhaps revenge, here’s a couple of clues for a puzzle I will never make.

    (theme-giving answer, 12 across)
    Iced? (8)

    (themed answer)
    12 drug containing unknown vessel (3, 4)

51. Whoops, that should be Iced? (7), miscounted the letters.

    And thanks to Paul and manehi!

52. Oleg@49 I think I’d rather use the words penchant for, rather than weaknesses…
    However, I wonder whether, having compiled hundreds of crosswords already, Paul is simply going though a thematic or keyword phase. Does one ever run out of fresh ideas as a crossword compiler.
    Oh, and I notice that both Celtic and Queens Park Rangers go by the nickname of The Hoops btw…

53. Re 21d . I suspect Paul was thinking of the Johnny Tillitsons Hit “poetry in motion’ Living in Brighton Paul is well acquainted with the Amex .Nice puzzle though

54. Took a while to get going, but getting ETIHAD solved 12 for us, and then things started to fall into place. LOI was AT SOURCE, though AT COURSE almost made sense.
    [I don’t think anyone likes the fad for using sponsors’ brand names for football grounds. It’s an ugly reminder of how professional football had lost its soul. The European Super League isn’t dead, just biding its time]

55. Am I the only one to parse 11a as “Go red” = “back socialist after U-turn”, followed by “a Tory”?

56. Another here who struggled in vain to fit X, Y or Z into ANFIELD (my last in).

57. Gladys @56. I think if N (or n) as representing *any* number, whereas unknown numbers are those which you list. However, I had read the clue as FIELD for unknown, or large and indeterminable number (as in the expression “ball-park”), N for number, A for away. I realise that the order of these elements is wrong, but on the upside at least I wasn’t trying to fit X into AFIELD. 🙂

    My last in was 21d, which someone (sorry, forgotten who) solved first. This goes to show there’s no such thing as a hard or easy clue, just one that the solver finds either tricky or obvious.

58. My least favourite type of puzzle. Lots to dislike

59. Maybe some research into the history of Brighton and Hove Albion’s move to the Amex might inspire some of the earlier posters. A decade of fan inspired campaigning is worthy of celebration.

60. Enjoyed this a lot. Those who grumble about football grounds don’t seem to complain when the knowledge required is galleries, theatres and museums. I’m not a football fan these days (I fell out of love with the game around about the time the grounds started becoming sponsored as in most of these examples), but I’m still aware of the curent names. It’s general knowledge, but it’s also a lot more common knowledge than loads of crossword staples (much less so for overseas solvers though, I’ll admit).

61. [matt w @50: brilliant! I stepped up to the plate… I nearly struck out… but I think I got there in the end 🙂 (OK so I googled)

    Am I right in thinking the enumeration in the ‘gateway’ clue was problematic, since the definition would lead more naturally to the plural (8), but you need the singular (7) for the themed answers? ]

62. Pikestaff @55 that was my reading also.

63. FOI was “COAX”, so from there “AMEX”, and I assumed the theme was financial. After constructing CARROW ROAD and hitting “Check”, I looked it up and realised I wasn’t going to have a good time with this one.

    Re: MarkN “…when the knowledge required is galleries, theatres and museums”. I’d be happy to consult a list if such a theme came up (like I did for the Wagner special), but I can’t remember encountering one. Or any gallery other than “TATE”. But football teams and grounds come up that much more often (see Guardian 28330, the same setter, only a year ago). I appreciate Paul including some more distinctive labels rather than just mundane place names, but that also meant they weren’t in the lists, and non-fans wouldn’t have a hope of guessing them.

64. I didn’t find this easy manehi, as evidenced by my posting this late in the day. I got the theme very quickly but based on numerous recent Paul’s, I assumed Ground would cover various meanings or at least various sports. Wrong!! Although hard, I did enjoy it. Didn’t know and didn’t get Op Artist.
    Thanks Paul and manehi.

65. I cheated on the keystone clue, GROUND. I do hate it when they have one clue that is essential to solving the rest of the puzzle; I cheated on that one more out of pique than anything else; I probably could have gotten it if I’d persevered. But then it went quickly; I’d heard of all the stadia except AMEX, but that one came easily from the wordplay. (I tried for a few years, back in the first decade of this century, to get into soccer. It didn’t stick, but in the meantime I picked up the names of many of the stadiums.)

    [We have the same disease over here with more and more sports stadiums being named after corporations. In Chicago, two of the four have corporate naming deals. My beloved White Sox play in a place that’s now named after a mortgage company; I refuse to use that name, like most fans I know. The basketball/hockey arena is the other one; it’s called the United Center, after the airline, but that’s actually not a bad name at all for a sports arena; one doesn’t even think about the airline if the name rolls off the tongue so well. Wrigley Field and Soldier Field are sacred; no one would dare sell their names.]

66. MattW @50 and MrEssexboy @61 , think I got the first but do not know any for the second. Will put my ideas on PREVIOUS Paul blog, do not look if you do not want spoilers.

67. Well this was good for me as a toffeeman. Strangely the one I couldn’t get was AT SOURCE. Word blindness.

    Thanks to Paul and manehi

68. Pikestaff@55 No. I did as well.

69. Not cricket, Paul! Thx!! A million!!! But for a mixed-up, cross, aging fart-about like me I think you missed an opportinity for sneaking another 12 in (3,7)

70. [Roz @66/matt w: I’ve left a reply – and some more spoilers! – on the previous Paul blog (for 16 Dec puzzle)]

71. [ More spoilers but think I am on the wrong track, stuck in two different ways. ]

72. Ouch! That was a disaster for this American (even after using Wikipedia to list all the stadia in the UK). It also didn’t help that I’m almost never on the same wavelength as Paul.
    Ah, well…

73. [Roz @71: You’re on the right track, just about to pull into the station… see the Other Side for (my) solution]

74. [Jay in Pittsburgh @72 – commiserations! On the other hand, matt w’s clue @50 should be a piece of cake for you… ]

75. BenT @36 – thanks for that. I do read the sports pages, but I don’t consider boxing a sport. Organised violence, yes. Should be banned.

76. I’m happy to find I have company among the disappointed. I was happy to see Paul was the setter, then crestfallen when I deciphered the theme. I wouldn’t have known the stadium names even if I had lived in the UK for decades. But I suppose it can’t always be about me, even though it would make the world a better place. You have to throw those people (sports fans) a bone now and then.

77. Chardonnet@26. Your surprise at the Alex being so high in the world suggests you may be of my fairly advanced age.

    Once the GROUNDS theme was spotted we Crewites were looking for Gresty Road, or the Mornflake Stadium, but CAFC are obviously below Paul’s horizon. And I think you must have left Crewe before we had the brilliant Limelight Club – sadly now gone.

    But very decent puzzle and helpful blog. Thanks both.

78. ravenrider@2 if you’re still around — a person who plays the lute is a lutenist, not a lutist (don’t ask me why).

    Got the beginnings of 7d. MARROW? BARROW? NARROW? None of the above — okay, try curtailing CARROT — oh. What the hell is a carrow, some breed of dog I’ve never heard of? Googled it and found it was a stadium. Okay, does STADIA work at the all-important 12a? Nope. Not ARENAS either (or would it be ARENAE?) Took a lot of crossers and a google list for a theme group of which I’d never heard of a single one. And what kind of a word–mangle is ETIHAD? A jorum, I suppose, since it was so clearly clued that I put this weird word together and then looked it up.

    [Our own minor league baseball stadium in Hartford is, if you would believe it, Dunkin’ Donuts Park — talk of corporate naming! and the team is the Yard Goats, which has something to do with our railroad history.]

79. mrpenney@65 – while my feelings on corporate ground-naming have already been expressed, your post may lead to a shift in my opinion: I used to work for a Chicago company and remember that Wrigley Field, named after the chewing gum firm, was a hallowed place for many of my colleagues. Wikipedia tells me that Wrigley owned the Cubs for quiet a while rather than just sponsoring the ground, but it’s still a corporate-derived name, so I suppose one day folk may say the same of the Etihad etc. Well OK, maybe not.
    Valentine@78 – that is brilliant.

80. Tassie Tim @ 75. I feel the same about several football codes.

81. essexboy@61: Thank you! You are giving me far too much credit, the enumeration was problematic because I was fuzzy-headed and counted the number of letters wrong. If the imaginary grid called for it, one could do the plural for 12 and then start the other clue “One of the 12…”

82. Thanks, manehi, for explaining “poetry in motion”, which completely escaped me. I realised early on that Motion referred to the former Poet Laureate, as I’d been caught by that in a previous Guardian crossword, but that’s as far as I got. Thanks, too, to my favourite setter: I’m sure the curmudgeons are greatly outnumbered by the fans.

83. [Late reply to Gazzh: Wrigley Field is not technically named for the chewing gum company; both the field and the gum are named after Mr. Wrigley, who as you say owned both. The confectioner has never had any of its branding at the baseball stadium, and pays no money to the Cubs.

    [The first Busch Stadium in St. Louis was similar. The current incarnation, however, does get corporate sponsorship from Annheuser-Busch.

    [An analogous question: does Bayer Leverkeusen still get any aspirin money, or is the name just a legacy of the era when companies had football teams for their employees? I wonder.]

84. erike44 . On the other hand, I got the ‘poetry in motion’ thing. Had no idea there was a Poet Laureate Motion.

85. I am surprised no-one has commented on 16 which is an indirect anagram.

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