Guardian 28,921 / Qaos

77 comments on “Guardian 28,921 / Qaos”

1. I looked for a theme but couldn’t see it – when I put my LOI, FINDING, the penny dropped!

2. This was good fun and I got the theme with CORAL and REEF going in early. When I got CLOWN I then looked for FISH which then gave me STINGRAY. I thought FINDING NEMO (OMEN reversed), the animated CLOWNFISH was particularly clever. Then GREAT BARRIER(S) REEF, SYDNEY HARBOUR, SCHOOL, DORY and TANKS added to the theme. PRESTIGE, PARALYSED and SPLIT were also excellent. Setter on top form.

   Ta Qaos & Eileen.

3. Thanks Qaos and Eileen
   No theme for me, but I haven’t seen either film. I didn’t parse the DNEY part of SYDNEY – very clever. I was hoping for an explanation of “for the king” in 25a!
   The 2 definitions for GREAT aren’t very different.
   Favourite PRESTIGE – I like clues where I use the bits to build up the answer.

4. I enjoyed most of this, but there were several I couldn’t parse: DORY, DENTIST (still don’t get it), BARRIERS (hadn’t heard of Royal Society), TRIFLING (why dalliance?) and RELEGATE. And I wasn’t aware that a honk was a bad smell.

5. Lovely stuff. The OMEN penny just dropped in the middle of Hampstead Heath. Beautiful morning here 🙂

   I got all the 23 references before I got 23 which is a testament to the quality of the wordplay

   Today’s earworm? Obviously it’s DALLIANCE from the Wedding Present’s Seamonsters album

   Cheers Q&E

6. GDU @4 – to trifle is to dally (with someone’s affections, for instance.

7. I did see the theme, and in time to help, but could not understand the king (apart from it being a fish) in 25ac. Greatly admired the crossword, though, and thanks for the blog. Hope someone can explain?

8. Found him! – backwards in 9a. The theme did help me here, even though I have never seen the film. It confirmed REEF, even though the definition as a bank seemed dubious to me. Couldn’t work out what the DENTIST (apparently there is one in the film) had to do with the king, though. Thanks, Qaos and Eileen.

9. The “for the king” is obviously a reference to The King’s crown. 😉

10. Just for once I did think of looking for a theme. It seemed to be Australia, but there weren’t really enough there on their own. It did help me get 4d, after which I spotted Barrie but not the Royal Society. Isn’t the s in “writer’s” superfluous?

11. I don’t always get on well with Qaos but this time I got over half on the first pass. Then it all slowed down and I didn’t get the last couple in the NE.

    But I did enjoy it – there were some lovely clues. I particularly liked TRIFLING, TANKS, PARALYSED, RELEGATE and OPPONENTS

    Thanks Qaos and Eileen (needed your help parsing a couple)

12. Eileen, I thought of Arthur Daley (at 21a), who did plenty of twisting and turining in Minder.

13. True, TassieTim!
    Thanks, all, for the additions. I have to go out to a meeting now.

14. TimC@9 – I did ponder for long time about Elvis (re the King @ 25ac). You are probably right but the article seems to be dated 2012? Maybe there is another explanation?

15. STINGRAY reminded me of this other animated feature. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sgkk-MMif-4

16. TerriBlislow @14, I thought the wink emoticon would have helped. Blogs are a difficult form of communication. 🙂

17. Sorry TimC – I am far too technophobic to spot the significance of an emoticon. I liked your witty idea though.

18. I knew to look for a theme and, once I’d got REEF, CORAL, GREAT, BARRIERS and SYDNEY, assumed it was an Australian one.
    Then DORY swam into focus.
    I haven’t seen the cartoon, nor its predecessor, so I googled the plot – but it seemed to have her hunting in American waters. Clearly a deeper knowledge of the source material would have been a help…
    Personally, I thought the clue to OMEN was a tad desperate, for surely the cry of surprise is Oh, not O, but I can appreciate that a setter may sometimes box themselves into a corner and absolutely have to get a particular theme-word in, come what may.
    And besides, I rather liked ABSENT, CLOWN and DENTIST (I simply assumed “king” was a cheeky bit of misdirection). What’s more, I now know some more kinds of fish – which is bound to come in handy with future crosswords!
    So thanks to Qaos for the education, and to Eileen for the explanations

19. I spotted fishy references, but not having seen the film at all, the other theme words meant nothing to me, I’m afraid. Still, enjoyed the crossword nevertheless, though it took me a while to get on the right wavelength. I was hoping for elucidation on the king reference on 25a, but I remain puzzled. I think the word ‘VERSION’ is missing from your parsing of 18a, Eileen. Thanks to Eileen and Qaos.

20. What no Qarithmetic?! No Roman numerals?! Is Q sickening for something – or, as my grandmother would have said “feeling a little queer”?
    The toughest Qaos I can recall … or am I just feeling a little queen?!
    Many thanks, Eileen and Qaos

    (Eileen – you may have missed the “version” bit of your parsing for INVASION?)

21. Couldn’t parse TANKS as I’m not familiar with that meaning of ‘honk’, and am still in the dark regarding the king in 25a. The explanation in Tim@9 seems much too obscure even as GK.

22. Left rather cold by this as I had no idea what the theme was, and didn’t bother to delve for it. And as LOI was DORY, that might have been part of the reason. Have obviously rather missed out on the pleasure that others on here have got out of it. Several that I couldn’t parse – SYDNEY, INVASION, PRESTIGE, and BARRIERS. Perhaps on reflection I wasn’t committed enough to this Qaos offering this morning….

23. I kept hearing Ringo’s voice on this and it was between Yellow Submarine and Octopus’ garden
    Nice quirky puzzle,
    Thanks Q and Eileen.
    Funny that I hated the whale in Moby Dick being referred to as a fish whereas FISH is defined as part of the animal kingdom.
    (I hated Moby Dick apart from the first sentence)

24. 9 across “Warning”. Jumped straight in with the abbreviated version of what I say when surprised (FO) and (RE) the crossword standby soldiers. Thinking “it probably isn’t but I’ll give it a shot”. It wasn’t. Needed the theme to finish.
    And I don’t see why the regular early commentators are puzzled by 6 down. It’s a frequently used device which they never normally have a problem with.
    https://www.theguardian.com/crosswords/cryptic/28700#6-down
    https://www.theguardian.com/crosswords/cryptic/28502#15-down
    https://www.theguardian.com/crosswords/cryptic/28074#14-across

    For some reason, this comment was removed by a Guardian moderator. As was my follow on: “I’d love to find out why my innocuous comment has fallen foul of the moderator. All I did was provide links to other Guardian crosswords. No swearing, no spoilers, nothing.”

    It’s become a very strange place to talk about a crossword puzzle lately.

25. All good fun although, as some other commenters, despite knowing there had to be a theme it all passed me by – yet again.
    I took the king reference in 25A to be misdirection and confess I didn’t give it much more thought. Was held up for ages by entering dash for 1D and then struggling to make any sense of 9A where I was convinced oh was the cry.
    Thanks to Qaos and Eileen.

26. Is 25 reference to Arthur Dent? Seems a bit once-removed.

27. I thought “for the king?” might have meant “for the king, for example, as well as anyone else who might need one.” I also did not quite catch the theme ( . . . something about tropical fish . . . ), having never seen the movie.

28. There are some advantages to having children later than is customary. I have see Finding Nemo more times than I care to count. At the start of the film, Nemo starts SCHOOL whose teacher is a STINGRAY. When Nemo is found, he is on the premises of a SYDNEY DENTIST who has fish TANKS in his surgery and intends to GIFT Nemo to his ghastly niece, Darla. It really is a marvellous, beautifully animated film and you do not need children to enjoy it.

29. I have seen both films but didn’t spot the specific theme – just a general sort of ocean/underwater vibe to the answers. Qaos has managed to fit in an impressive range of relevant words.

30. I found this much more difficult than usual for Qaos. Once I had finished I got the theme, which I had been looking for. There is apparently a sequel to FINDING NEMO, which is FINDING DORY.

    I couldn’t parse ODOURLESS because I thought the serious was dour, doh! I liked the wordplay in INVASION, and the surface and wordplay for PRESTIGE.

    Thanks Qaos and Eileen.

31. I did resort to googling King Dent 1st

    Sadly there is no such king

32. Tough puzzle.

    Liked FISH (which I solved after 3d STINGRAY).

    I could not parse 18ac, 25ac (‘for the king’ bit), 20d apart from the SY bit.

    New DORY = boat (for 15ac).

    Thanks, both.

    *I did not see the theme, and not familiar with Finding Nemo so would not have known the theme words.

33. re 25A – I liked the misdirection in this which made me think firstly of a King’s coronation, only then to realise it meant a tooth crown. Thanks Qaos and Eileen.

34. Thanks to Qaos and to Eileen for the usual comprehensive blog – I for one particularly appreciate you taking the trouble to spell out the answer to each clue you enjoyed as opposed to just quoting its number.

    ravenrider@10: The s in ‘writer’s’ in the clue for BARRIERS is intended to indicate ‘is’ so that we have: ‘blah blah.. is (the word) obstacles’.

    I think Cineraria@26 has it – the question mark indicates that the clue can be taken to be a bit iffy.

35. Unlikely explanations for the king. A dentist fish is a kind of wrasse a homophone of Ras as Ras Tafari King Haile Selassie or ‘king as a homophone of aching.

36. There is a “dentist fish” (aka “cleaner fish”) that scrapes a living eating debris from the teeth of sharks. A quick google to find a connection with King reveals that King Shark is a villain in DC comics, but it is not usual for a theme to cross genres so I don’t think that is the connection. Nevertheless I thought I’d put this here in case anyone with superior knowledge can find a more plausible explanation.

    Fun puzzle – thanks to Q & E

37. Getting Qaos’s themes are usually a 50-50 proposition for me, but today I got it three times! First, the Great Barrier Reef (even though Sydney is rather further south), then fish (in general), then Finding Dory/Nemo. At least it/they helped the solving, since at various times I went searching the grid for BARRIER and FISH. In fact, and I can’t believe I’m saying this, I think the theme made the puzzle too quick a solve.

    I’m another not convinced by any of the arguments for “for the king”. It seemed to be a rather forced way to misdirect away from the dental meaning of crown, but that’s not like Qaos, so I remain stumped.

38. Enjoyable puzzle, though I had no hope of getting the theme, and I did know enough to look for one.

    I’d never have parsed BARRIERS, even though I know of both Barrie and the RS, so thanks Eileen for that and a blog that is a pleasure to read.

    And thanks to Qaos too.

39. Caught the theme after a handful of clues – having seen Finding Nemo when it came out originally. It seemed a LOT of the clues were connected and helped me with the solve. PARALYSED is in the film (Nemo is paralysed by jellyfish) and I thought PROTECT could have been there too as the film is all about how Nemo’s Dad tries (and fails) to protect his child from the wide world. Very nice puzzle!

40. The theme was no help to me. I have seen Finding Nemo once, but found it largely forgettable. The puzzle may have been improved by missing the theme, as Dr. WhatsOn implies; it was quite challenging but gradually fell into place. PRESTIGE, PROTECT, HARBOUR and GIFT were fun to piece together, as was STINGRAY (leading to the amusing FISH).

41. Missed the theme as always, and found this quite chewy. LOI was FISH, which was a ‘really?’ moment rather than a penny drop one. Liked the Tom Daley reference in PARALYSED, and SCHOOL was another favourite. Don’t understand the king reference for DENTIST, and see that I am not alone in this. But happy to have remembered ‘dis’ from a crossword a while back. Thanks QAOS and Eileen.

42. DENTIST as an answer only makes sense to me in the context of the theme which I didn’t spot. Trees were in the way of the forest as usual for me.

43. Arthur Dent in H2G2?

44. Was wondering how dis = hell but Google produced “In Dante Alighieri’s The Divine Comedy, the City of Dis encompasses the sixth through the ninth circles of Hell.”
    Might come in useful again sometime.
    Thanks both

45. Alastair @43 – DIs crops up fairly often in crosswords (sorry I didn’t spell it out) and is definitely worth filing away. In Roman mythology, Dis was the god of the Underworld, the equivalent of the Greeks’ Pluto, and thence used for the Underworld itself.

46. Pleasant, though not a very characteristic Qaos puzzle, I felt, with a lot of single letters in the wordplay, no trademark alphanumerics and surfaces that range from the excellent (CLOWN) to the utterly bizarre (ODOURLESS). And the ‘king’ in the clue for DENTIST is either so subtle that none of use can discern its meaning, or just a complete red herring (rather than blue tang 🙂 ).

    Not having seen Finding Nemo I missed the full significance of the theme, but the marine flavour was obvious even to me!

    Thanks to Eileen and Qaos

47. Thanks Eileen, no idea about the King either (am a big H2G2 fan but can’t see how it might link to Arthur Dent as suggested by a few, can anyone explain?) and had dalliance=Fling with no idea where the TRI came from so thanks in particular for that gerund mention. Thought this was tough but enjoyable and my theme spotting got as far as coral etc but at least helped with Dory and Reef. I thought there were some very nice touches in here and good to see Daleys from different generations alluded to in 22a (could have been Daley Thompson too!). Thanks Qaos.

48. Hi Gazzh @46 – yes, I was beguiled by TRI FLING for a few minutes, too. 😉

49. Thanks for the blog, INVASION and PRESTIGE well constructed but most others very Sybil Fawlty.
    DENTIST = Dent first , so Arthur a legendary king. I am not at all convinced .
    AlanC number 2 by seconds , two days in a row, just your natural modesty I think.

    Rosa Klebb in the FT today with a quantum physics theme.

50. Thanks Qaos. I saw a fish/maritime theme unfolding but Finding Nemo is not on my sonar so I missed the main point. Still, I enjoyed this with ticks for PRESTIGE, SCHOOL, ABSENT, and SYDNEY. Thanks Eileen for the blog. [Eileen: I’m glad you had time to solve and comment on the superb Rosa Klebb crossword in the FT today. By the way, you can now solve the FT online — it’s free for now.]

51. I have a vague memory of in the fourth or fifth book of the trilogy (when Arthur Dent was the sandwich maker?) there were lots of creatures going off to see the King, who turned out to be Elvis. A very long time since I read it, so that might well be garbled.

52. [copmus @23: I share your views on Moby Dick. Decades ago I was told in school that there were 3 great American novels: The Scarlet Letter, The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn, and Moby Dick. I read and loved the first two; I then tried to read Moby Dick and put it aside around the midpoint — not my cup of tea.]

53. Waited patiently for anyone to shine a light on the king conundrum.
    Looked for theme in vain though I saw watery answers and Australian.
    Still enjoyed looking for theme.

    Thanks Qaos and Eileen

54. I got ‘Stingray’ and immediately went hunting for other Gerry Anderson series. Sadly disappointed – another day, perhaps. I wonder whether ‘for the king’ somehow refers to draughts.

55. I thought the theme was Australia, had I spotted it, I would have got 15a, which was the only one I missed. A new meaning of DORY for me.
    Still don’t understand DENTIST.
    Thanks both.

56. Finished this in between exciting incidents in Poland v Mexico (and for those unfamiliar with sarcasm, you just saw it) however like many others I’ve never seen the film so the theme was of no help this week – I wasn’t even certain it was Finding Nemo until I came here ! Thanks to Eileen and Qaos.

57. I’ve a vague theory re the dentist – Charles can’t wear one till his formal coronation, so right now the only person who can fit him with a crown is a dentist.

58. Thanks for all the comments – so relieved to see I was not the only one to be perplexed by 25ac. Rather hoped Qaos would drop in to enlighten us.
    The suggestion that appealed to me most was Tim C’s @9 – but, as TerriBlislow said @14, it was ten years ago (although that’s nothing in Crosswordland).

    Tony Santucci @49 – Bless you for that! I’m used to downloading the FT puzzles but my printer is on the blink just now and I had to resort to constructing a grid for myself – I’d do anything for a Rosa! I didn’t notice the the new facility and I don’t ‘do’ apps – but I found I could get it anyway. Just wish I had seen it earlier!

59. Nemo’s home is the GREAT BARRIER REEF. His father and Dory travel from there to SYDNEY HARBOUR to find him.

60. Thanks, springy @58. I really think I should perhaps see this film – though it’s not my usual cup of tea . 😉

61. I never see themes, but as I was stuck I started looking and found GREAT and BARRIERS, so 17a had to be REEF.

    And I know nothing of Arthur Dent, but the former being the name of a king and the latter being the first four letters of DENTIST – with the last three being crosswordese for “first” – is enough for me to get a good night’s sleep.

    Thanks to Qaos and Eileen.

62. I’m afraid I can’t help with 25 across either. Perhaps Leontes would be a better king to consult for that one. Unfortunately I didn’t enjoy this rather awkward puzzle, or its theme, as it had completely passed me by. 23 down almost tickled my fancy.

63. Not sure if GREAT, BARRIERS, and REEF were supposed to be drawn together in the theme, but it is the Great Barrier Reef, not Barriers.

64. And there is now a Sydney Harbour artficial barrier reef which is attracting coral and tropical fish as the waters are warming while the Great Barrier Reef is dying. Hard to find the joy in that. Enjoyed the crossword though. Tickled by FISH

65. Just put my loi DENTIST in rather doubtfully, before checking today’s paper, then coming here to check the parsing. I am shocked to find we can’t collectively explain what The King was doing there, despite some very valiant efforts. I don’t think I have seen this happen before, because of the enormous pooled knowledge and brain power of this community. If anyone (preferably Qaos) finds a definitive answer, where will it be posted?

    I thought I had spotted the theme – the (Australian) marine environment. But now I see I missed a significant part of it.

66. Brilliant! I was beaten by most of the NW corner but loved the puzzle. Thanks Qaos and Eileen and thanks to this group for illuminating the theme. I often have a crack at the Guardian crossword but with a bit more time on my hands at the moment I’m now (eventually) completing it most days – and where I can’t quite parse or complete, I’ve really enjoyed untangling the knotty ones here with your help. And I’m glad I wasn’t the only one trying to understand “the king”!

67. Tuned in for an explanation of King but see we are all baffled. Come on Qaos please explain yourself.

68. Well, as Tim C points out, Elvis did have a dental crown, which in 2014 was purchased for £6500, according to the usual tabloid outlets. But we could at least have expected a capital K if that were the intended reference, couldn’t we? Elvis was known as ‘the King (of Rock ‘n’ Roll)’ as far as I can see. But to say that the story is little-known would be something of an understatement!

    Or: it’s not that at all 😀

69. I’ve just looked up Finding Nemo on Wikipedia & found lots of words that occur in the solutions. A dentist plays a prominent role of course. Was hoping that said dentist would have a king reference, but no luck.

70. Isn’t anyone going to fill the ‘king cavity …

71. I’m late here but perhaps this will help fill the ‘dentist’ cavity. If the clue had ended ‘but not for the king’ (with or without ?) the answer would have been fairly straighforward. As it stands, ‘…for a king?’ is a question – it takes us to the answer ‘no’ and thus to the obvious answer, as above. Not that I saw this yesterday…

72. Plotinus@71 thanks and I think that makes more sense than anything else above (though it doesn’t quite come off for me), muffin@51 my memory of those later books is even vaguer than yours so i will happily go with your suggested connection, garbled or otherwise.

73. Gold, Plotinus. I think you’ve capped it off.

74. I am a bit surprised that Qaos hasn’t come forward with the explanation of the “king” reference in 25a. Or is he (somewhat maliciously?) enjoying watching everyone squirm over that clue?

    The theme left me in cold water, knowing nothing about it, so thanks Spooner’s catflap@28 for filling me in. And thanks Qaos and Eileen for the fun and help with some elusive parsing.

75. No problem for me spotting the theme. I didn’t bother trying to parse barrier(s) what else could it be with great and reef in there.

76. From Qaos on Twitter
    25 ac is a cryptic definition with a play on the double meaning of “crown”. I think the original version was “Fitter of king’s crown?” which might have been neater but wasn’t deemed as fair.

77. Well that helps. Not. I still don’t get it.

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