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I found this quite hard work, though in retrospect there were several clues that I should have got much more quickly than I did – a sign of good clueing, I suppose. A couple of words that were unfamiliar to me, but clearly clued. Thanks to Imogen.
I’m off to the hills now (despite a rather worrying weather forecast) so won’t be able to respond till later.
| Across | ||||||||
| 1 | SAMOVAR | First of various aromas swirling round boiler (7) V[arious] in AROMAS* |
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| 5 | PLUMMET | Professor on board joined dive (7) PLUM (Professor Plum, from the board game Cluedo) + MET (joined) |
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| 9 | ROGUE MALE | Household work our Ma managed with glee (5,4) (OUR MA GLEE)* – novel by Geoffrey Household |
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| 10 | DIRER | Order court put out: resistance is much worse (5) DIRECT (order) less CT, plus R |
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| 11 | GANG | Band‘s number received in silence (4) N in GAG (to silence) |
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| 12 | LIP SERVICE | Mouthy pair regularly heard failing to offer token support (3,7) LIPS (“mouthy pair”) + hEaRd + VICE (failing) |
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| 14 | CARESS | Without transport, left out a touch (6) CARLESS less L |
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| 15 | RÉCLAME | In speech demolish feeble publicity (7) Homophone of “wreck”+ LAME (feeble) – a unfamiliar word to me |
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| 16 | BUSKING | Transport chief hoping for donations from the passengers? (7) BUS KING, and buskers sometimes ply their trade in the London Underground etc |
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| 18 | GARISH | Tasteless and more than a little vulgar, is Henry (6) Hidden in vulGAR IS Henry |
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| 20 | ENID BLYTON | Work by indolent author (4,6) (BY INDOLENT)* |
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| 21 | WRAP | Stole whiskey — on charge (4) W (Whiskey in the phonetic alphabet) + RAP (charge, as in “take the rap”, “rap sheet”) |
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| 24 | HIT ON | Flirt with sweetie, keeping it secret (3,2) IT in HON (honey, sweetie) |
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| 25 | EINDHOVEN | Public service vehicle shortly makes the side of Dutch city (9) A bit obscure to a non-follower of football like me: PSV Eindhoven is the city’s club or “side” |
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| 26 | STUDDED | Worked in school soundly, so covered in stars (7) I presume this is meant to be a homophone of “studied”, but it doesn’t really work for me |
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| 27 | SQUINCH | Small arch, one of 5 in school (7) QUIN in CH – another unfamiliar word to me |
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| Down | ||||||||
| 1 | SPRIG | Shoot? November is not part of the season (5) SPRING less N |
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| 2 | MAGENTA | Graduate engages someone to promote book: The Color Purple (7) AGENT in MA |
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| 3 | VIEW | Watch TV that is fitted inside car (4) I.E. in VW |
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| 4 | REAR ITS UGLY HEAD | From Hades, guilty criminal, first bum to make unwelcome appearance (4,3,4,4) REAR (bottom, bum) + (HADES GUILTY)* |
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| 5 | PLEASURE GROUNDS | Firm reasons to support appeal for amusement park (8,7) PLEA + SURE GROUNDS |
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| 6 | UNDERSCORE | Emphasise being no more than 19 (10) Being no more than 19 means you are UNDER a SCORE (20) |
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| 7 | MARTINA | Am about to train extraordinary tennis player (7) Reverse of AM + TRAIN – I am also a non-follower of tennis, but have certainly hear of Martina Navratilova |
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| 8 | TERRENE | Gardener returning to turn over part of the earth (7) Hidden in reverse of gardENER RETurning |
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| 13 | BERIBBONED | In base, part of chest covered in decorations (10) RIB BONE in BED (base) |
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| 16 | BEECHES | Denizens of forest run out of trousers (7) BREECHES less R |
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| 17 | SHIATSU | Massage small gap, twisting bottom (7) S + HIATUS with the last two letters “twisted” |
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| 19 | STRIVEN | Worked hard, stone split (7) ST + RIVEN |
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| 22 | PINCH | Squeeze a measure of column at foot of page (5) P + INCH (as in column inch) |
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| 23 | THOU | Second person‘s half-expressed ideas (4) Half of THOUghts; thou is grammatically the second person |
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I needed Chambers for reclame.
Beaten by Imogen again, but nothing unfair. Everything clued okay, I just didn’t see them. Thanks for parsing BERIBBONED. I had RIB, and wondered why BEBONED meant base.
Thanks to Imogen and Andrew
I had to come here to understand 25a. Held myself up by blithely entering PLEASURE GARDENS without worrying about the parsing.
ROGUE MALE very clever.
[I haven’t started the puzzle yet but just wondered (re Philistine’s recent Prize puzzle) whether anyone else heard Susie Dent discussing ‘apricity’ on Radio 4’s ‘Today’ this morning. It’s in her latest children’s book of words for joy. I heard it just before I got up!]
As Andrew’s travelling, can someone parse Eindhoven please?
Thanks Imogen and Andrew
Too many obscurities for me to enjoy this. Google tells me that RECLAME is actually a Dutch word, so needs an indicator. STRIVED is more obvious than STRIVEN. SHIATSU? PSV Eindhoven? Geoffrey Household?
I rather liked BUS KING.
PSV = public service vehicle
Elenem @5
I don’t know what PSV stands for in the football club, but it could also be “Public Service Vehicle”.
Some very enjoyable stuff here – the clue for LIP SERVICE was very neatly put together, the surfaces for BUSKING and ENID BLYTON were amusing.
Somewhat kicking myself for not getting the reference to PSV Eindhoven, though a football team clued by public transport really ought to be Tram-near Rovers. Of the two really obscure words, I thought SQUINCH was fairly clued, with the wordplay as clear as the word was obscure; RECLAMÉ, on the other hand, I thought was a bit much. The bit that isn’t a homophone of wreck is Liberace’s clothing, not feeble.
And while I’m more of a fan of homophones than most, I’m with Andrew about STUDDED (why stars, for goodness’ sake?)
I admire Andrew’s industry in locating the reference for ROGUE MALE.
Thanks, both.
Nho ROGUE MALE as I hadn’t heard of Geoffrey. Missed the PSV in EINDHOVEN (PSV stands for Philips Sport Vereniging – Philips Sports Association),
I enjoyed PLUMMET for the ‘Professor on board’ and also the PUN for STUDDED.
Two days ago I had to recall Arsenal in the 1969/70 Inter-Cities Fairs Cup Final to solve ANDERLECHT. Highbury used to cost 2s6d(13p) to get in.
Today’s football reference is much more up-to-date. Arsenal play PSV EINDHOVEN in the UEFA Champions League today.
No idea what that costs at The Emirates Stadium – probably an arm and a leg.
Re 7: Also Martina Hingis, please.
NeilH@9 – “Tram-near Rovers” – 🙂
Didn’t find this enjoyable at all. As usual, I agree with muffin. I had to consult Google for ‘reclame’, which was completely new to me, I failed to parse ‘Eindhoven’, the clue for which was too tortuous for me, and I did not understand ‘Rogue Male’, not knowing the book or its author. Sorry to be negative but that’s how it was for me.
What muffin@6 said, more or less.
Edinburgh wasn’t correct, so it had to be a Dutch city, but I had no idea about the vehicle part.
Must remember in future that PLUM is a professor, must remember in future that PLUM is a professor…
Thanks to Andrew and Imogen
Anderlecht, PSV Eindhoven – hopefully Dukla Prague and Borussia Mönchengladbach will be with us soon to delight the HMHB aficionados
Ticks for LIP SERVICE, BUSKING, and MAGENTA
Cheers A&I
I thought the PSV trick would be a step too far for some here, but you have to allow some (PSV) licence.
Ucn usually rely on Imogen for a few that are a bit scholarly or otherwise out there. Terrene, reclame and squinch aren’t, er, household terms, tho squinch rings a faint bell, probably from an earlier puzzle. A pleasant enough hour’s pottering … the unwelcome bum and the rib bone were amusing. Thanks Im and A.
Thank you. Felt smug as I knew SQUINCH and once tried unsuccessfully to read ROGUE MALE after seeing Peter O’Toole in the film. STRIVEN is fine by me. But then came a cropper: guessed EINDHOVEN but had no hope of connecting it with Public Service Vehicle. And SHIATSU was completely new, requiring liberal use of the check button. Gave up on TERRENE. Thanks to Imogen for a real challenge .
I sometimes find myself not to be on Imogen’s wavelength at all, so was glad when I eventually solved this one after a fair bit of head-scratching and looking things up. I did have a few “unfamiliars” against my solutions and I see I was not alone – I had problems too with the NHO author Geoffrey Household in 9a and his book ROGUE MALE, 15a RECLAMÉ, 25a EINDHOVEN (which I would never have parsed in a million years) and SQUINCH 27a. But
I found they could be solved (if not fully parsed) using a combination of the wordplay, crossers and google. Big frown here for 26a STUDDED/studied? – even though “star-studded skies” is a lovely phrase – I too felt I might be missing something? Neil H@9, I also enjoyed 12a LIP SERVICE, 16a BUSKING and 20a ENID BLYTON. I did eventually unravel BERIBBONED at 13d, Crispy@2, when I saw RIB BONE rather than just RIB and quite liked it. I rather like using the phrase “REAR ITS UGLY HEAD” (4d) so I gave that one a tick too.
Thanks to Imogen and Andrew.
I heard of “Rogue Male” many years ago when it was serialised on the TV, starring (I think) Peter O’ Toole.
Re RECLAME. My Chambers has it as French. NeilH @9 – you’ve got the acute over the wrong E.
One day (perhaps soon) we won’t have a discussion along the lines of “but I don’t pronounce it like that”
NeilH @9. Star studded, as in a star studded cast.
RÉCLAME – the RÉC with an acute accent would sound like rake rather than wreck.
RECLAME is ‘Obsolete form of reclaim’. RECLAMÉ is Spanish. RÉCLAMÉ is French,
I had an easier time that yesterday, but the Dutch football team was just wilfully obscure, and impossible to get if one didn’t recognise the other meaning of PSV – the actual city name isn’t even hinted at in the “clue”.
Imogen’s one of my “don’t attempt” setters, but I was feeling brave today. Didn’t enjoy it much. My “never heard of” list was longer than I’d have liked — RECLAME, TERRENE, SAMOVAR, SQUINCH & BERIBBONED. That last one I had to reveal, and I thought it a very odd word, until I belatedly realised the emphasis should be on the second syllable, not the first and third, as I was doing! I had no idea how to parse ROGUE MALE, knowing nothing of Geoffrey House, PLUMMET, as I’m unfamiliar with Cluedo, or EINDHOVEN — not into football. Are STUDIED & STUDDED meant to be homophones? And rap/charge was a bit of a head-scratcher.
Dave@15 – Professor Plum in Cluedo.
“Studded” is a clear homophone of “Studied” in a fair few parts of Scotland, for interest. The “-ED” ending gets realised as the IPA [id]
Putting in reclaim held us up for a while. Couldn’t parse EINDHOVEN. Enjoyed the crossword.
Thanks Imogen and Andrew
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rogue_Male_(1976_film)
I’ll have to watch it again now.
I was defeated by SQUINCH and BERIBONED. I thought this was going to be quite easy as everything fell into place in the NW quite quickly; but after that it was much slower. ROGUE MALE prompted memories of a Radio 4 adaptation way back in the 1980s with Michael Jayston (a wonderful voice). Does anyone else remember this? …Anyway, a very enjoyable puzzle. With thanks to Imgoen and Andrew: and best wishes for the walk.
“Wilfully obscure” sums it up. Irritation takes the fun out of solving.
thanks A and I! when the penny dropped for ROGUE MALE, I was very pleased (found the book on my parents’ bookshelf when I was a teenager and then read everything else I could find by him)
Geoff Down Under @24… “Are STUDIED & STUDDED meant to be homophones?” no, they’re not. Nowhere in this sort of clue have I ever read the word “homophone”. THEY ARE A PUN (or an Aural Wordplay as someone recently said). Don’t get me started!! 😉
Tim C @32
What is “soundly” meant to mean if not “homophone”? No indication of “pun”.
Actually this one isn’t too bad for me.
Then you’ll need to explain how the pun works, Tim C. I only have an IQ of 82.
My sister-in-law’s father was a keen fan, and worked for Phillips who owned PSV EINDHOVEN, so that was easy for me, unlike SAMOVAR, SQUINCH, RECLAME and TERRENE. I also thought of the ANDERLECHT clue. Like Andrew, I found this hard work but in retrospect it wasn’t so tough. I imagine ENID BLYTON has been spotted before but I thought it was brilliant. Other favourites were GANG, MAGENTA, LIP SERVICE, BUSKING and BEECHES.
Ta Imogen & Andrew.
Andrew, your missing the S in your parsing of SQUINCH.
Thanks for the blog, pretty good overall and pleasantly tricky in some parts.
I thought MARTINA and PLEASURE GARDENS were very weak definitions but the wordplay okay.
It had to be ROGUE MALE , could not see why, after the blog I now think it is a very good clue. SQUINCH was in Azed earlier this year.
I remembered PSV from Denzil in “The Jolly Boys Outing ” .
A film or TV series can be star-studded.
RECLAME is obscure to me, I do not approve of homophones for wordplay of obscure words.
Good puzzle, distinctly tricky in parts.
Ticks everywhere from me, but particularly for ROGUE MALE, ENID BLYTON (great anagram), SHIATSU, EINDHOVEN (so glad it wasn’t Crvena Zvezda) – all of which raised a smile at the PDM – and the clever ‘rib bone’ and ‘sure grounds’.
I tried RECLAIM at first, with no great conviction, and TERRAIN, with even less. RECLAME was vaguely familiar, but TERRENE not at all – clearly clued, though.
STUDDED sounds like ‘studied’ in the fruitier versions of RP (though not in my accent) so I was comfortable with this.
Thanks to Imogen and Andrew (good luck up top)
I’ve checked on strived/striven. Both are acceptable, with the former being more modern and now more common. However with rived/riven, the former is apparently US English, so I suppose STRIVEN becomes favourite.
Great fun as usual with Imogen’s puzzles, but got very stuck at the end on SHIATSU (once recognised, clue of the day) and STUDDED. Also enjoyed ROGUE MALE, a mystery until I googled it, and the ENID BLYTON anagram. The EINDHOVEN clue was a bit recondite. Many thanks to I & A.
I usually think everyone here is a little too complimentary but today I loved the puzzle and so many had reservations about it. I even got the homophones which normally fox me.
Thanks Imogen and Andrew – enjoy the hills
And 20a Enid Blyton was just a great clue
Thanks Andrew for parsing of ROGUE MALE and PLUMMET
Being an Arsenal fan I was keen seeing their first opponents in the puzzle
Which was rather enjoyable.
So thanks also to Imogen.
Nuntius@29 I remember Micheal Jayston reading the book on Radio 4 about 10 years ago, not an adaptation , just a straight reading, many episodes. I remember seeing him first in Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy, a star-studded cast for the ages.
Lots to like here but 9A was not among them. I figured out the anagram but drew a blank on the parsing, never having heard of the author. Is Geoffrey a Household name in the UK?
The PSV in PSV Eindhoven stands for “Philips Sport Vereniging”, in English “Philips Sports Association”. The club was formed in 1913 for the employees of the Philips company. For more see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PSV_Eindhoven
Jacob
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geoffrey_Household?wprov=sfla1
He wrote the book that the more famous Peter O’Toole film was based upon
Matthew @46 I know who he is now, my question is whether it was fair to expect us all to have known it before. NHO the author, the book, the film, or the radio play I would call that not-so-general knowledge!
Mind you, I did get 25A immediately, which apparently was tough for non-followers of football. However, in its defense, with the crossers there is a reasonable chance of identifying the Dutch city even without parsing PSV. For 9A there is no such help and one is left filling in the anagram in the only way it can fit while scratching ones head over the absence of definition.
Roz@43: A friend has reminded me that he had a cassette tape of Jayston reading an adaptation in the 1980s… or perhaps it was the whole book. I see Jayston is still with us at 87, and has recorded the Smiley books on Audible. Sadly, I can’t find a recording of him reading ROGUE MALE.
ROGUE MALE was the only anagram of those letters that made words, so I put it in, even though it didn’t sound like household work. I was expecting to come here to find that it was some weird British brand of carpet cleaner or something.
And I’d heard of PSV Eindhoven, but I still didn’t quite get the clue for some reason.
Re Professor Plum: in North America the game is simply called Clue, of course, and it led to this wonderfully campy film in which Prof. Plum is played by Christopher Lloyd. (But it’s the women who steal the show, especially Madeline Kahn and Eileen Brennan as Mrs. White and Peacock respectively.)
Tough but enjoyable.
Favourites: SAMOVAR (such a lovely word); UNDERSCRORE, BERIBBONED (loi).
New for me: SQUINCH; TERRENE; RECLAME (although I know the word REKLAME = advertisement from Bahasa Indonesia which I presume was derived from Dutch; Geoffrey Household’s book, Rogue Male (9ac) – thanks, google!
I could not parse 25ac (as usual, foiled by my ignorance of all things football but also never heard of PSV = public service vehicle), and also 26ac – tbh I still don’t get it – is it a homophone (soundly) and/or what is the pun? star-studded = worked in school/cast? Still baffled…
Thanks, both.
Tough indeed, but loved this. Though PLEASURE GROUNDS held me up for quite a while as it provided a vital spine down the puzzle. ENID BLYTON the pick for me, excellent, have just finished reading a biography of her. Last one in was RECLAME, nho before but it had to be that from the clueing…
26a is a pun, Michelle @50 because “studied” sounds a bit like “studded”
If I don’t get GK that’s OK by me, I don’t expect to, but wordplay would help. I did know ENID BLYTON though. Liked that one.
Never knew that meaning of ‘denizens’ in BEECHES, but found one I could relate to, a bit closer to home.
https://davidtng.wordpress.com/2013/01/19/antarctic-beech-veneration-and-moss-bonanza/
TERRENE I found on Onelook, two entries with sources of ‘difficult’ or ‘obscure’ words. Food I do get. Is that where terrine comes from. Something cooked in a clay (earthenware) pot? I’m not going to stir the pot on the homophones though. Who am I to say? 🙂
muffin@6 sums it up for me too. Can’t say Household is a household name.
muffin @33, I’ve not come across a dictionary where “soundly” is defined as “homophone”. Ironically, it is itself a play on words.
Oh, go on paddymelon @53. I’m off to bed.
Tim C@56. 🙂 Me too.
Thank you to those who have pointed out that “star-studded” is a thing. Some time I shall learn not to post grumpy comments first thing in the morning, exposing my ignorance.
ROGUE MALE took me ages . I eventually sorted out ROGUE and I have read the book , so I knew it was a work, but I was wondering about Household, cleverly put at the steart of the sentence, until Andrew reminded me. I failed to parse EINDHOVEN, even though I have heard of the team. I’m not a football fan, but I don’t live in a vacuum. I had reclaim as well , but cold not square that with publicity. Like Roz, I don’t think homophones for obscure words are fair.
I was thinking this should have been Monday’s cryptic after SAMOVAR, SPRIG and VIEW went in very quickly, but things slowed right down after that
Thanks A&I
Obviously today is not the day when we don’t have any “Well I don’t say it like that” comments. Sigh.
Wish I’d googled ROGUE MALE and RECLAME rather than wasting time pondering. Luckily I knew SQUINCH from previous puzzles so was able to correct STRIVED. LOL for BUS KING.
Thanks both.
I am viewing on my phone so apologies if the question has been answered already PSV is Philips Sport Vereneging. Vereniging = Society. The Dutch multinational electronics company began their business there.
TimC@52
thanks for explaining re studied/studded as a homophone. I never would have guessed that anyone says those two words in a smiliar way.
I really enjoyed this puzzle but imo that clue is the weakest one in the puzzle.
Shot myself in the foot by confidently entering SASH for GANG on the grounds that arsenic makes your fingers go numb – not something I know from personal experience! – but corrected course eventually. Thought the test would be quite stern when I saw the setter and so it proved. Very satisfying to finish. I liked MARTINA. How many people are there so famous that just their first name says it all?
Nick @64: Most of the examples I can think of off the top of my head are female vocalists. Cher Sarkisian, Madonna Ciccone, Adele Adkins, Beyonce Knowles….
Fairly impossible for me, although I started quite well in the NW corner. It was a case of finding a word that fitted in and then seeing if it was possible to parse it. That didn’t work for ROGUE MALE, which I bunged in anyway.
I did like PLUMMET for the professor on board, BUSKING as a transport chief, GARISH, which I thought was well-hidden, the good anagram for ENID BLYTON and the definition for BERIBBONED.
Oh no, not the dreaded homophone police again – as usual, compare the pronunciations given in Collins for STUDDED and for studied. They sound identical to me.
Thanks Imogen for the struggle and Andrew for sorting it all out.
Thank you Robi! I don’t think I speak in a fruity version of RP (Gervase @38) but STUDDED and “studied” sound exactly the same to me. How do people pronounce them so that they’re different?
Lord Jim
The distinction would be that the last syllable in “studied” is “deed”, but in “studded” is “dead”, or a schwa.
Robi @66: Many of us pronounce STUDIED with a long i in the final syllable but STUDDED with a very short i. However, there are plenty of folk for whom they are completely homophonic, for which reason I’m not complaining this time! (see me @38)
My reservations re 26ac have nothing to do with the homophone: they sound exactly the same to me (thank you, Robi @66). I’m just bemused as to how ‘star-studded’ can mean ‘covered in stars’ without the ‘star’!
Follow-up on Nick@64’s comment on MARTINA. During the coverage of the US Open earlier this month, at one point the camera lit on Martina Navratilova in the stands, and the commentators said almost exactly that! [How I remember that, beats me!]
Eileen @70 i think it works better if you include “so” in the definition?
Needed the blog for an understanding of 9a ROGUE MALE. The best I could come up with was that rogue male = meal, (the preparation of) which would represent household work (which our ma managed with glee). Which would also have been a pretty rubbish clue so I’m glad the answer is as it is. I was also surprised to see 15a RECLAME, which is a word I know through italian, but have never come across as an english word.
Overall enjoyed the puzzle although I spent a lot longer justifying the answers than actually filling in the grid. Many thanks to Imogen and to Andrew for the blog.
I enjoyed this a lot and will seek out Imogen in the future.
As a football follower, I’m amused in retrospect that I had to come here to parse EINDHOVEN.
A few things worked out well from me. I knew the Geoffrey Household novel and thought that the clue was very clever.
“Reklama” is the word for the advert break in Poland.
Surely P is top of page not foot
Eileen @70: Bodycheetah @72 has the right explanation: ‘so’ isn’t just a link word – ‘so covered in stars’ = ‘covered in stars in this manner’.
Far too many obscurities for me today, although many that I got were funny and enjoyable. Thanks to Andrew for explaining so very many (even several I’d had to reveal). What a mixed bag!
Jeceris@75. It’s just P for ‘page’ with INCH underneath it (at its foot).
nuntius@29&48
https://archive.org/details/rogue-male-episode-1
I thought the clue for STUDDED was very good.
I held myself up unnecessarily by trying to fit RECK into 16a, and gave myself a good clout with a handily placed tea-tray when I realised that REC was enough. Yes, RECLAME was obscure, but the real obscurity for me was SHIATSU which most people have seemingly been happy with. Perhaps it’s my deficient GK or just that I didn’t see the synonym for ‘gap’ with its final letters twisted.
I had heard of the author Household and the book ROGUE MALE, but had to look it up after solving because I didn’t know that he had authored it.
On the whole a very enjoyable puzzle to occupy a very wet and windy morning, and always a pleasure to come here to find out how many people “don’t pronounce it like that”!
Thanks to Imogen and Andrew.
Free download/stream: Rogue Male – by BBC – Publication date 2004-01-01 – Topics Drama, Thriller, BBC, radio – Language English
An anonymous wealthy Englishman goes on a shooting trip to the continent. In his sights is ‘the biggest game of all’: the head of a brutal European dictatorship.
Geoffrey Household’s classic British thriller was first published shortly before the outbreak of war in 1939. The first of a 15-part reading read by Michael Jayston.
Producer: David Jackson Young. Made for BBC 7 by BBC Scotland and first broadcast in January 2004. Addeddate 2021-03-16 23:00:09
jeceris @75: as I read it, page by itself gives the P, with “at foot of page” indicating that the “measure of column” came below the P.
NHO Household or his work, but without that, I would have to agree that a ROGUE MALE would be a piece of work in any household.
Bodycheetah @72 – belated thanks. I was diverted.
Réclame is used in French Canada to mean an advert or what we call in English Canada a commercial.
‘Alack, our terrene moon is now eclipsed,
And it portends alone the fall of Antony. ‘
Yet again, Shakespeare come in handy.
I really enjoy Imogen’s puzzles. Busking was my favourite clue today. Seems I am on her wavelength. Yesterday, though, I really struggled with Jack.
[Henry @87
Imogen is a he, surprisingly! He also sets as Vulcan, usually on Mondays.]]
Henry @ 87 Imogen is a he – Richard Browne, onetime crossword editor at the Times.
Additional to other comments, Rogue Male, brilliantly read by Michael Jayston, turns up on Radio 4 Extra every now and then
I absolutely loved this one. Husband and I eventually finished it, all parsed (I’d never have got EIDNHAVEN, or parsed it myself). While I agree with many of the reservations, I wasn’t fussed about them – because I thought it was all so clever. Once I’d solved each one, I thought “why didn’t I think of that before” – brilliant cluing! Particularly liked REAR ITS UGLY HEAD.
TimC (I agree with you) and muffin, puns and homophones are two types of aural wordplay. If you accept that indicators like “soundly” or “they say” signal aural wordplay, and not just homophones, then there should be no arguments.
If the word “homophone” were banned from this site, the number of comments would be greatly reduced.
I’ve just watched the movie again. Rather good. It features a ship with no less than three detectives in its crew:
Poirot‘s Inspector (James) Japp, Philip Jackson – Hazell‘s James Hazell, Nicholas Ball – Taggart‘s DCI Jim Taggart, Mark McManus.
Pronunciations of studied and studded. I would have said, before listening to these, that the were identical. Where do people pronounce studied this way?
@78 & @82. Thanks for pointing that out. Unorthodox use of “foot” IMO.
Dave Ellison @94
That’s exactly the difference I gave @68. You would have to swallow the last syllable of “studied” to make them the same.
As I said, though, far worse examples have been used in crosswords.
I still struggle with Imogen. Just not on the right wavelength. 2 Down did remind me of a fun video that explains why Magenta only exists in our heads. It does not exist on the spectrum. We’re imagining it How cool is that?
Link:
Eileen @4 – I heard Susie Dent mention it. It was a new word for me and I shared my pleasure in it on X the day it appeared in the crossword. I’m looking forward to some apricity once the winds and rain die down here in Dundee.
Re studded/studied, perhaps it’s worth pointing out that neither this nor any other cryptic clue I’ve ever seen has used the words ”precise homophone for all English speakers”. Surely phrases like “soundly”, “on the radio”, “in conversation” allow the setter a bit of leeway.
MattS@100 – well put.
Fun but never heard of RECLAME and STUDDED just doesn’t work!
A nice challenge from Imogen with one or two quibbles. REAR ITS UGLY HEAD is superb – also ticks for PLUMMET (though I suppose without the GK and the murder-suspect prof., you’d be stumped), SPRIG and ENID BLYTON (but that last because I loathe the said author with a vengeance, so ‘indolent’ seems rather apt).
DIRER seems to me a rather strained comparative. I suppose it’s OK in crosswordland.
Now the downsides. Never heard of SQUINCH though the wordplay and crossers helped me out there. I failed to parse EINDHOVEN – another victim of the ‘not following the beautiful game’ persuasion – though I should have remembered PSV. And when I got to STUDDED/STUDIED I wasn’t sure which to write in – not having solved 13d yet.
13d – BERIBBONED. Yes, very neat and my LOI – except that I’d call “Rib bone” a bit of a tautology. However it then occurred to me, did Imogen have in mind the “Dem Bones” song? I don’t think it has the lines: “my rib bone’s connected to my … back bone, and my backck bone’s …” etc. – but it might do?
Thanks anyway, Imogen – not one of his toughest – and Andrew.
Jeceris@95. Isn’t “unorthodox” a sign of an innovative and challenging setter? And it’s not at all unfair (I’m not suggesting you said it was 🙂 ) as the clue reads “at the foot of” which can mean below or underneath.
I should have added, both TERRENE and RECLAME were also new to me – though easy enough to guess.
MattS@100 – well put, as Crispy has already said. I’m sure that will put paid to all the complaints about aural puns that always seem to plague the comments here. 🙂
(Or “aural pubs”, as I was lucky enough to prevent my spell checker have me say. Note to self: must educate my phone about pubs and puns.)
Memories as a 12year-old in Grammar School when as a class we read aloud (in turns) Rogue Male. Trying not to turn the pages as some fellow pupils droned on slowly, hesitating, mis-pronouncing, coughing, snorting etc. A guaranteed way to be put off literature for life. Still I got the clue in about two seconds! Unlike ‘studded’ which I disliked.
Laccaria@103. I’ve checked the lyrics of Dry Bones but even without a direct quote I think the use of RIB BONE is fine. It raised a grin rather than an eyebrow for me, anyway.
Karen @99 – thanks for that: glad someone saw my comment. 😉
Re RECLAME, it’s interesting how a knowledge of some foreign language or other can enlighten one with respect to the lexical corpus of one’s native tongue. I knew it from Turkish (reklam), others know it from Polish, Dutch, Indonesian etc etc. I guess it comes from French. I wasn’t aware it was used at all in English. LSNED
I’ve said this before but hey, people have complained about aural wordplay clues before so here goes:
The erroneous idea that aural wordplay clues should use exact homophones is an invented misunderstanding by solvers that bewilderingly persists.
‘Twas never thus.
Ximenes called them ‘puns’, which is perfect.
Clive@110. My edition of Chambers has RECLAME (acute accent on 1st E) as a French word. Interesting that it has reappeared in many other European languages but this is the first time, as far as I know, that I have seen it in English. I was able to get it (finally) before checking in the dictionary because I recognised the association with acclaim. (Different spelling but I assume this is because the latter has been long assimilated into English.)
16dn Can trees be denizens of anything? Thought they had to be animate.
Thanks, Imogen and Andrew.
Valentine@113 Denizen is simply an inhabitant ( animal or plant) . personally I would add fungus as well .
Frankie @81, our wireless will certainly not get BBC7 and I heard this about 10 years ago, it must have been repeated on Radio 4 .
… yep, with all their mycorrhizal communicating fungi are definitely denizens…
[Roz @115. It ceased to be BBC 7 some years ago. It’s now Radio 4 Extra. You can receive it on the same device you use to contribute to this discussion]
Agree with all the pun not homophone comments, and also with anyone who thinks studded for studied DOESN’T WORK AT ALL as a pun. I’m amazed to read that so many people found it acceptable on either level. I’d love to see a Venn diagram of the various objections.
SPRIG: November is BANG in the middle of the shooting season. No blood sport enthusiasts here? How extraordinary.
James @118
I’m coming round to the view that a crossword “homophone” means “sounds quite like”; by that criterion, this one works. What I can’t understand is that some posters above pronounce them the same!
muffin @119. I’m with you on pronouncing them the same, but there have been many times when I haven’t been sure which of those two, or similar pairs, someone has been saying.
And “homophone” in crossword blogs, as you say, is just shorthand for “sounds a little bit like”. No setter actually uses the word, do they?
Thanks both. An entertaining dnf.
I’m left with the image of ENT specialists forced to have studded nostrils and lips in order to pass their finals.
James @118 — so if someone told you a joke about an unintelligent footballer and the punchline was “The only thing he ever studied was his boots!”, would you not get it?
🙂
Rob T, surely if anyone laughed at that it would be after footballer, not boots. If someone said that to me how I’d expect to hear it, there is honestly a good chance I would not understand the joke. If I did twig, I would be baffled that someone had thought it could make a joke. Nice try, though,
James/Rob T – I believe the correct response to a successful pun is a groan rather than a laugh.
Thanks Andrew and those who further explained PSV, I knew all the pieces but failed to connect to the clue somehow. Really enjoyed reading Rogue Male at school so that was a highlight, plenty of others and felt like a worthwhile achievement on completion with RECLAME which took embarrassingly long considering “Kein Reklame” stickers adorn every letterbox here including ours ( so there’s another language to add to the pot, where is essexboy to explain this when we need him?) thanks Imogen!
James @123 — and I mean this in the nicest possible way 🙂 if you genuinely wouldn’t understand that example pun then I can see your potential frustrations with some aural wordplay clues, and I sympathise. Perhaps our brains are all wired a little differently!
Thanks FrankieG @79 and @81. Strange, in that I could have sworn this was produced in the 1980s when I was at University…Time playing tricks…
sheffield hatter@80
I failed with SHIATSU for the same reason as you. I couldn’t get beyond SLIT for a small gap. I’ve heard of a SHIH TZU which fits but it’s a dog and doesn’t parse, though it features as a homophone in a joke I once read.
A good challenge as always from Imogen, with lots to enjoy. Liked LIP SERVICE, BUSKING and UNDERSCORE, while SAMOVAR has a lovely surface and stirs fond memories of the one my father was gifted by Russian friends in the 60s. Did not parse EINDHOVEN.
While not too bothered by the homophone/pun thing, I’m with James@118: Rob T @122’s “pun” would most likely leave me bemused, rather than laughing or groaning. I (eventually) solved it, but with the mental shrug “so some people must think they sound similar???”.
I think I more or less started the “they’re not homophones, they’re puns” four or five years ago, but fter banging my head against a brick wall for so long I’m now resigned to the fact that whenever one comes along there will be a chorus of moans. There are more important things in life, like climate change policies.
Alphapha @121. That is funny. 🙂
I am also kicking myself for not seeing PSV and also missed Anderlecht recently! Some hard bits in this one. ROGUE MALE fitted the crossers but I missed the literary hint.
Thanks both
Rob T @122, I thought it was an amusing pun. 🙂
Pm@132: purr, purr.
Alphapha @121. 🙂
I actually believe I’m closer to understanding the differences in how people understand ‘aural wordplay’ following the above debate!
If we accept for the purposes of this discussion that an aural wordplay clue doesn’t need to be an exact soundalike but can be ‘similar’ then what remains is what I would call a ‘threshold’ difference across different people’s perceptions of similarity.
Using the given example of ‘studied’/’studded’, whatever the accent used (i) the consonants are all pronounced the same, (ii) the first vowel is pronounced the same, and (iii) the final vowel sound can change according to accent. Now, in my mind this qualifies as ‘similar’.
What I’m realising is that some people place the threshold for ‘similarity’ higher than I do. Which possibly makes solving certain crossword clues more frustrating. As I said in a previous comment, brains are maybe wired slightly differently to each other; I’m beginning to better understand how that might work.
Thanks all!
Rob T@137 Phew!
RobT2137. Just an academic question, I wonder how many of the target audience of Guardian cryptics, and commenters here, speak RP, and what proportion of the world’s English speaking, first or second language, do they represent?
What you say about brains being wired differently is true for first language acquisition, and interference from L1 to L2.
The other thing I would say, from what I have perceived of comments here, is that the 15sq community is very literate. but maybe not aurally in tune.
But I gotta say RobT@137, good on you (as I think you also set crosswords) for acknowledging this.
RobT@137. Re the studdied/studded debate. As a speaker of English where the second vowel is a schwa, even though I’m aware as a linguist, with studies in first and second language acquisition, and someone who topped the class in acoustic and articulatory phonetics, and as a language teacher, the RP studied/studded didn’t first come to my mind or my ear.
paddymelon — a belated thank you for engaging with my rambling thoughts on this subject 🙂 and yes, I do set crosswords but actually try to avoid aural wordplay if I can, simply because I want to avoid the inevitable quibbles! But as I said, I do feel like I better understand the ‘why and how’ of aural wordplay not landing for every solver!