Guardian 27,481 – Imogen

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A tough challenge this morning, with a few rather obscure words, but all gettable in the end. Thanks to Imogen.

Just in time, I spotted the theme: we have the members of the Monty Python team on the grid: Graham CHAPMAN and Eric IDLE as whole answers, Terry JONES and Michael PALIN as parts of answers, Terry GILLIAM from scarGILL and IAMbus, and John CLEESE down the right-hand column. No other Python references that I can see, but you never know..

 
 
 
 
 
 
Across
7. RABELAIS Bawdy author‘s first mob, so to speak (8)
Homophone of “Rabble A”, i.e. the “first mob”
9. ATOMIC Kind of kitten or cat, one included in bill (6)
TOM (cat) I in AC (account, bill). Reference to the girl group Atomic Kitten, which even I have heard of
10. LOOM Appear vaguely in room, where one goes mad unnoticed (4)
LOO (room where one goes) + MAD less AD (notice)
11. VIRGIN SOIL Part of Atlantic’s valuable reserve that’s not yet exploited (6,4)
VIRGIN (as in Virgin Atlantic + S (from Atlantic’s) + OIL (valuable reserve)
12. SENSOR Flowers return, fed with nitrogen, I detect (6)
N I in reverse of ROSES
14. PROTRUDE Be proud of rhubarb that Mrs Grundy’s bottled (8)
ROT (nonsense, rhubarb) in PRUDE. “Proud” in the sense of sticking out
15. CHAPMAN Two blokes meeting pedlar (7)
CHAP + MAN
17. DEHISCE What is in Washington? Start to explore and gape (7)
EH (what?) + IS in DC+ E[xplore]. In botany, to dehisce is “to burst or split open at definite places, discharging seeds, pollen or similar content.”
20. SCARGILL He led miners from cliff to ravine (8)
SCAR (cliff) + GILL (ravine); Arthur Scargill, leader of the miners’ union during the strike of 1984-85
22. IAMBUS I have no leisure — almost behind, for example, in verse (6)
I AM BUS[y]. “Behind” is an example of an iambus
23. MONUMENTAL Huge old quantity halved in a sort of arithmetic (10)
O NUM[ber] in MENTAL
24. IDLE Lied about being unemployed (4)
LIED* – a clue that seems strangely out of place by being so easy
25. CARE OF For delivery to a force to be reckoned with (4,2)
(A FORCE)*
26. DOW JONES Keeping wife and Jack working, makes index (3,5)
W J ON in DOES (makes)
Down
1. NANOTECH Pen a note: check boxes measuring small dimensions (8)
Hidden in (“boxed by”) peN A NOTE Check – there’s surely more to nanotechnology than just measuring..
2. GERM European misses out on a new beginning (4)
GERMAN less A N
3. WAIVER Be undecided about one claim forgone (6)
I in WAVER
4. PALINODE I make careless mistake in feeble poem, after change of heart (8)
I NOD (make careless mistakes) in PALE. A palinode is “ an ode in which the writer retracts a view or sentiment expressed in an earlier poem.“ A new word to me, justified by its use in the theme.
5. CONSORTIUM More than one firm Tory type rejecting Heath from tedium (10)
CON SORT [Ted]IUM
6. PITIED Sympathised with one sort of public house under pressure (6)
P + I + TIED (as in “tied house”, a pub that is under an agreement to buy all or most of its beer from a particular brewery)
8. SCRAPE In predicament, fight with energy (6)
SCRAP (fight) + E
13. SUPER-DUPER Top-class con man? (5-5)
Double/cryptic definition: a con man is one who dupes
16. A MILE OFF Very inaccurate shot (where one saw it coming?) (1,4,3)
Double definition – as in “I saw it coming a mile off”)
18. CRUELLER Vineyard Frenchwoman runs with less compassion (8)
CRU (vineyard) + ELLE + R
19. SLATED Some roofs are abused (6)
Double definition
21. CHORAL Church oversees exam for singers (6)
CH[urch] + ORAL (exam)
22. IN-LAWS According to judges, sons are not consanguineous (2-4)
IN LAW (according to judges) + S[ons]
24. IGOR King cobra kills every other Russian (4)
Alternate letters of kInG cObRa

43 comments on “Guardian 27,481 – Imogen”

  1. Thanks Imogen and Andrew

    A very slow start – for a long time I just had SCARGILL, IDLE and CHORAL – but I’m glad I persisted as there was lots to lie (I missed the theme, of course!). At one point I had everything left of the NW-SE diagonal and nothing to the right (bar an odd square).

    CRUELLER was an example of one of my favourite types of clues – no clear idea of what it would be, but buildable from its parts.

    I had to Google “Mrs Grundy”, but it’s a nice clue. I didn’t know PALINODE but guessed it must be some sort of poem. I took ages to see NANOTECH as I was sure that “check” would give  final CH. It did, but much more directly than I was thinking.

    One quibble: I think the “In” spoils 8d. To be in a predicament is to be in a scrape, but SCRAPE isn’t “in predicament”.

  3. For me, not “all gettable in the end”, Andrew. Sigh!
    Missed 17a DEHISCE and 4d PALINODE (both unfamiliar) and in the end forgot about ATOMIC Kitten being a band even though I too have heard of them, so failed on 9a as well.
    Also missed the theme as I got bogged down in the detail and degree of difficulty. So embarrassed, as I was a huge Monty Python fan back in the day.
    Thus I was defeated on the day by Imogen, but hopefully my pride has only suffered a flesh wound.
    Thanks to Imogen and Andrew.

  4. Sorry about the sob-story, I meant to say I really liked 10a LOOM, 14a PROTRUDE (as muffin@1 said, a nice clue), 2d GERM and 13d SUPER-DUPER! Hopefully there will be no homophonic debate about the latter because I think it is a super-duper clue, cleverly incorporating the two pronunciations of “duper”.

  5. That was a struggle for me and nowhere near completing unaided. I was skillfully mislead by Imogen and didn’t get enough answers to spot a theme before coming here. Annoyingly I had jotted down DEHISCE but rejected it as a possible word so didn’t put it in.

    Thanks Imogen and Andrew

  6. So busy remembering all those words I vaguely remembered that I didn’t think to look for a theme, which is a shame as I was getting much better at actually noticing such things.  Two clues in particular made me smile – 9a and 13d

    Thanks to Imogen and Andrew

  8. Thanks to Andrew for clearing up parsing, as I had biffed a few answers.

    At 11a I don’t see how Virgin can be called part of the Atlantic – surely Branson’s empire isn’t that extensive !  (As usual, didn’t think of looking for the theme.)

  9. Thanks Andrew and Imogen.

    I’m not sure that ‘care of’ means ‘for deivery to’. A letter to ‘John, care of Jenny’ is *not* for delivery to Jenny.

    Like peterM, I thought Virgin as ‘part of Atlantic’ a bit iffy – I assumed it referred to the Virgin Islands, but whether that or the airline, I didn’t like it. Maybe just sour grapes as I failed to solve that clue.

  10. Thanks Andrew; your explanations certainly needed for quite a few of those. Too many obscurities in a puzzle spoil it for me. Not an enjoyable experience, ultimately.

  11. Thanks Imogen and Andrew.

    Too difficult for me; I gave up with about half of it solved. I didn’t know ‘nod’ as meaning making careless mistakes.

    Needless to say, I didn’t spot the theme, although I like the way the setter formed GILLIAM [I actually got SCARGILL at the beginning].

  13. re 11A Like others I took it to be a reference to the Virgin Islands being part of the Atlantic Ocean, if it is a nod to Branson then it’s the wrong way round – Atlantic would be part of ‘the virgins’.

    An enjoyable puzzle but too many unknowns for me to finish.

    Thanks Imogen and Andrew.

  14. Tough for a newbie. Thanks to Andrew – lots of ‘D’oh!’ moments on reading the blog.

    A question on 6d; how is pressure = PI? PSI I could understand. PI doesn’t appear on the list of SI and non-SI units of pressure, as far as I can see.

  18. A DNF for me too, although I did get DEHISCE and PALINODE. Missed the theme, of course.

    Thanks to Andrew and Imogen.

  19. Thanks to Imogen and to Andrew. My woes with Imogen continue and a DNF for me, though comforting to see others missed the same ones as myself. I failed on palinode and care of (though I did consider it) and carelessly entered nanomesh for one down. That said still enjoyable, if somewhat tough, and liked super duper in particular. Virgins made me smile because I remember being there in the 70’s. Thanks again to Imogen and Andrew.

  20. I concur with the quibbles over virgin being part of Atlantic. I would add how can ATOMIC be clued as a type of kitten without a reference to the pop group. It is after all the only context in which it is valid.

  21. I’ve never heard of Atomic Kitten.

    I thought that “I detect” would lead me to somebody like Holmes or Poirot, sp that slowed me down some.

    I thought the verse foot was an iamb, never heard of IAMBUS.

    I’d heard the word PALINODE somewhere, but hadn’t the vaguest idea what it meant.

    Super duper & lit?  A super-duper isn’t just a con man, it’s a top-class one.  Double def doesn’t quite work.

  22. Failed on PALINODE. I was wondering why he couldn’t have set CAMISOLE or BARITONE instead, but now I’ve been on the blog I see why. I NOD = “I make careless mistake”??? I’m with Robi @11, muffin’s example @12 having inexplicably passed me by (but like muffin, I had to google Mrs Grundy to get the PRUDE).

  23. About two thirds of this was fairly gentle by Imogen’s standards, but the rest more than made up for it. I would never have got PALINODE without cheating because nod = careless mistake was new to me too. RABELAIS was the other one I spent ages on – easy enough to parse in retrospect but still a pretty tough clue even with the crossers.

    Thanks to Imogen and Andrew

  24. Phew.  That was a slog, but nonetheless enjoyable.

    I share the misgivings re VIRGIN.  Not convinced by either the island or the airline reference.  One of those one enters on the basis of ‘spose’.

    Thanks to Andrew for the link to IAMBUS.  Again, bifd it but the definition is far too classical for me.

    Loved ‘rabble A’  and enjoyed looking up CHAPMAN (again).

    I think we’ve seen to nod before…and I did (again).

    Muffin @1:I think the ‘in’ at 8d is acceptable if it’s read as ‘re’.

    FtC @20:  Yes, I agree re kitten.  I was going to make the same comment.  The answer comes readily enough from the word play but I don’t think it’s enough to imply that ATOMIC is a kind of kitten.

    Those minor quibbles aside, a good but difficult puzzle from Imogen.

    Nice week, all.

    PS: Missed the them, of course.

  25. Thanks to Imogen and Andrew. Tough going for me also. I did know PALINODE and IAMBUS (from previous puzzles – as opposed to the more familiar iamb or iambic) and even here in the US could dredge up CARGILL, but as already noted other items were new to me or difficult to parse (e.g., the “tied” in PITIED).

  26. A ‘toughie’ today. ‘Palinode’ and ‘dehisce’ were new to me. Despite living in France and being a retired French teacher, I have never understood the word ‘cru’ as meaning ‘vineyard’ I use it to mean ‘vintage’ – which is correct, but ‘wordreference.com’ also gives ‘vineyard’. ‘Vignoble’ is the most common word for ‘vineyard’ in my experience. The crossword was excellent.

  27. Too clever for me today (I’m not at my sharpest by any means, but it would have defeated me regardless), but in retrospect I really like it.

    I thought the whole of “virgins” came from a shorthand form for the Virgin Islands, in the same way you’d say the Shetlands, the Canaries etc.

  28. MarkN @27 re Virgin

    That was what I thought too, but I didn’t like it. The Atlantic is an ocean so, by definition, cannot be dry land; the islands can be in the Atlantic, but they aren’t part of it. I thought the Richard Branson association worked better (still not my favourite clue, though!)

  29. I read it as ‘Part of Atlantic’s valuable reserve = Virgin’s oil  Not Virgin as part of Atlantic, which as people have said doesn’t make sense.   But I’m not really convinced by my reading either!

  30. Tough, again. Much to enjoy, again. I noted the same weaker clues, Atlantic, kitten and, for me, particularly the definition of nanotech. Why kills in 24d (apart from surface that is)? Loved 18d and 20ac.

  31. Like others, I found this tough. A DNF for me. Needed to cheat on DEHISCE. Decided it must be D????CE, so entered DXXXXCE to check. A little later decided it might be D??ISCE, and checked. After that only EH seemed possible for the missing letters, but still needed a quick search before feeling confident enough to put it in. Didn’t get PALINODE. Spotting the theme might have helped. I’m ashamed to say that I didn’t get RABELAIS either. My only excuse is that I think of the name it as “Rabble-eh”, rather than “Rabble-ay”, but I don’t think that’s enough to let me off.

    Surely (Virgin) Atlantic is part of Virgin, rather than the other way round. “Atlantic containers valuable reserve that’s not yet exploited”?

    Despite the above, an enjoyable mind-stretch. Thanks to Imogen and Andrew.

  33. I found this hard, partly because of looseness in the cluing, IMHO.  As Muffin said, the “In” of 8 is redundant (would be OK as a linker, written as “Fight with energy in predicament”), as is “shot” in 16.  I also didn’t get “kind of kitten” until I Googled.  Perhaps “popular kind of kitten” might have been a bit more of a hint.

    Some goodies too – LOOM, DEHISCE, SENSOR (how dare he use actual flowers, not flow-ers!) and PALINODE (which I didn’t get – would never have thought that that end could be the definition).

    Theme, what theme?  Oh, yeah…

    Thanks, I and A

  34. Didn’t enjoy this at all and gave up. Too hard for me and my cold. Theme ??
    Not much of a week so far!

  36. A difficult test. Nearly finished.
    No one has mentioned loom. I considered it but decided it is more than to appear vaguely needing overtone of threat. Also the convoluted wordplay defeated me. As it also crossed with nanotech and Rabelais it was challenging corner.

  37. I didn’t like this puzzle – I gave up with only about half of it completed, and came here for enlightenment.

    On doing so, I was slightly relieved to find that the extent of my pitiable failure was partly attributable to the rather recherché nature of some of the solutions* 😀
    E.g.s dehisce, palinode, iambus? Zounds!
    I can see that two of these recondite words are necessary for completion of the partial theme (which I of course never saw) – but then that theme itself begs the question ‘what happened to the Cheese/Cleese?’.

    * and is not at all – heaven forfend! – attributable to a deficiency of personal general knowledge 😉

    I agree with Andrew that the clue for 1dn is an inaccurate definition of the solution.
    I failed to solve *this* clue because ‘nanotech’ does not mean ‘measuring small dimensions’.
    IMO the clue could have preserved its surface and offered a better (although still imperfect) definition if it had ended with something like ‘for tiny machines’ instead of with “measuring small dimensions”.

    Also, although I did manage to solve 24dn, it triggered in me a suspicion that the clue might read better if it’s object & subject were reversed.
    But then I often think that about clues – usually after I clutch-at the first interpretation to occur to me of a particular verb within a clue, and then obstinately fail to consider any of its other common functions within our language

    **Full Disclosure**
    I cannot even fully *solve* most of the crossword puzzles here. So, I do not pretend (even pseudonymously) to have the ability to *set* crosswords – let alone to do so on a regular basis for a national broadsheet!
    As such I tip my hat to Imogen, and say to myself ‘you won’t defeat me next time!’ (although you very probably will 😉 )

    Slàinte,
    Gem.

  38. hmm, is it just me or is the Grauniad crossword getting a lot harder recently?  We used regularly to solve it in about half an hour – just about right after dinner for people with full time jobs.  Now more frequently we give up after the same amount of time with only half the grid completed or less.  Is the Guardian crossword going the way of many other intellectual leisure pursuits – aimed at retirees only?

  39. **its** object & subject!

    When *I* am Dictator for Life, whoever programmed auto-‘correct’ to invariably insist on the insertion of an apostrophe in to that word will find that theirs is among the first of the Heads on Spikes!

    Gah! >:-(

  40. beaulieu @ 9 :  It does if you’re the postman.

    Wow, that was tough!   Where would we be without the World Wide Web?    To give the internet its due, I think it is responsible (justifiably) for crosswords being harder now than they were in my youth.   On the other hand, EVERYTHING is harder than it was in my youth, so I may be on completely the wrong tack!   🙁

  41. That was the toughest puzzle I can remember. We did eventually get there, but it felt much more like a battle than an enjoyable experience. It took me and Mrs W 3 hours in the car to prevail. (The enjoyment was provided by the time spent with a grandchild between the journeys.)
    I’m surprised no one has mentioned the very unfriendly grid with few starting letters, combined with some pretty convoluted wordplay and obscure solutions. On the upside we did learn new words and there was one stand out clue for me – SUPER DUPER and DOW JONES was a nice definition. Hedgehog@34 – I dallied with Clarrie as well. I did spot the theme which helped with PALINODE, but didn’t see CLEESE.
    Thanks to Imogen and hats off to Andrew.

  42. Anyone who has read the Campion novels of Marjery Allingham will have come across various characters by the name of Palinode (just in case it was something you knew you’d seen somewhere, but couldn’t think where
    . .)

  43. I marvel at anyone who completed this, unaided or otherwise. Very tough indeed for me. I feel we lesser mortals desperately need a few doable crosswords in the next few days.

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