Thanks to Enigmatist. Definitions are underlined in the clues.
The special instruction says: “Clues supply tips associated with 5 down 23 across”
The first letters/tips of the clues give “FIND RACING’S DREAM COUPLE IN GRID”.
The dream couple is jockey Frankie Dettori, found in grid rows 3 and 13, and horse Enable found in the middle of grid row 8. The couple is attempting an unprecedented 3rd win in the Arc this Sunday.
Across
7 Feel unhappy about poetry putting oneself down? (4,2,2)
FELO DE SE : Anagram of(… unhappy) FEEL containing(about) ODES(form of poetry).
Defn: In Anglo-Latin, putting down/killing oneself.
9 In the light, dealer’s ultimate object of quest! (6)
RARITY : RAY(a beam of light) containing(In the …) [last letter of(…’s ultimate) “dealer” + IT(pronoun for an object/thing)].
Defn: As above, with “object” doing double duty;
or, if you object to “object” doing double duty:
Defn: The whole clue with “it”=object of quest.
10 Not leave time to visit state (4)
STAY : T(abbrev. for “time”) contained in(to visit) SAY(to state/to voice).
11 Deficits in coordination dip, as X-rays sadly show (10)
DYSPRAXIAS : Anagram of(… sadly show) DIP, AS X-RAYS.
Defn: … due to a disorder in brain development during childhood.
12 Roget’s last edition, which forms the basis of culture (6)
TISSUE : Last letter of(…’s last) “Roget” + ISSUE(an edition of, say, a magazine).
Defn: On which biological cells may be cultured.
14 A radical unknown line taken by new clergy (8)
GLYCERYL : [Y(symbol for an unknown quantity in maths) + L(abbrev. for “line”)] placed after(taken by) anagram of(new) CLERGY.
Defn: … in chemistry, derived from glycerol aka glycerine.
15 Chief supplier of element strong ale naturally retains (6)
GALENA : Hidden in(… retains) “strong ale naturally“.
Defn: An ore that is the most important source/chief supplier of the chemical element, lead.
17 It whitens stretch of shore round front of lake (6)
BLEACH : BEACH(the sandy stretch of shore) containing(round) 1st letter of(front of) “lake“.
20 Not wriggling clear of porters, even in a pickle or jam? (8)
PRESERVE : Anagram of(… in a pickle) [“porters, even” minus(… wriggling clear of …) “Not“].
22 Good indication of the appearance of spring nuts? (6)
CUCKOO : Double Defn. 1: The migratory bird whose arrival signals the start/appearance of spring in Europe; and 2nd: …/insane.
23 See 5
24 Debt compiler has for Listener’s ace, one of fifty (4)
IOWA : Homophone of(… for Listener) “I owe”(compiler/setter of this crossword, using the self-referential pronoun, acknowledging that he has a debt) + A(abbrev. for “ace”, the playing card with one pip).
Defn: …, the number of states in the US.
25 Republican enemy brought to order by independent (6)
YEMENI : Anagram of(… brought to order) ENEMY plus
(by) I(abbrev. for an Independent, a politician who is not a member of a political party).
Defn: Citizen of the Republic of Yemen.
26 Extremely tough work environment causing various ailments (4,4)
SALT MINE : Anagram of(various) AILMENTS.
Defn: …, literally or metaphorically.
Down
1 Adhering to socialist principles following Tories’ first victory in part of contest (4-4)
LEFT WING : [F(abbrev. for “following”) + 1st letter of(…’ first) “Tories” + WIN(victory)] contained in(in) LEG(a part/a stage of a contest consisting of more than one encounter).
2 Murderous guy: ‘How does it end?’ (4)
GORY : [G OR Y](answer to the question: What letter is at either end of the word “guy”/it, or, How does “guy”/it end].
3 College’s official notice lecturer’s got in working party (6)
BEADLE : [AD(short for “advertisement”/promotional notice) + L(abbrev. for “lecturer”)] contained in(…’s got in) BEE(in the US, a group of people coming together to do communal work/a working party).
Defn: A ceremonial officer in a college.
4 Old craft displayed by great striker keeping City up (3,5)
ARK ROYAL : Reversal of(… up, in a down clue) [LARA(Brian, a Trinidadian international cricketer, acknowledged as one of the greatest strikers/batsmen) containing(keeping) YORK(city in England)].
Defn: The first of ships so-called was the flagship of the English fleet which fought the Spanish Armada.
5, 23 Upcoming event in which tri-champ and rider explode into action? (4,2,4,2,8)
PRIX DE L’ARC DE TRIOMPHE : Anagram of(… into action) [TRI-CHAMP plus(and) RIDER EXPLODE].
Defn: The second most prestigious horse race, to be run this Sunday in Paris. And refer to preamble about tri-champ attempt.
6 Perpetual happiness finally found by not a large charwoman? (6)
STEADY : Last letter of(… finally) “happiness” plus(found by) “tea lady”(a char-/tea woman/lady serving tea) minus(not …) [“a” + “l”(abbrev. for “large”)]
8 Learning is necessary, helping to raise the standard (6)
ENSIGN : Hidden in(…, helping) reversal of(… to raise) “Learning is necessary“.
Defn: …/a flag.
13 Eyed banking special credit to support class printing (10)
SILKSCREEN : SEEN(eyed/observed) containing(banking) { [S(abbrev. for “special”) + CR(abbrev. for “credit”, in financial accounting)] placed below(to support, in a down clue) ILK(class/type) }.
16 Inducing sleep at last, spin concentric circles? (8)
NARCOTIC : Last letter of(at last,) “spin” + [O(letter representing a circle) contained in the centre of ARCTIC(Circle, the northern latitude)(concentric circles)].
18 No kid who plays trick (8)
HOODWINK : Anagram of(… plays) NO KID WHO.
19 Goes missing at draws (6)
TEMPTS : “attempts”(goes/tries at doing something) minus(missing) “at“.
21 Regarding Harcourt and Sheeran, say, as clarinet and saxophone? (6)
REEDED : RE(regarding/with reference to) + EDS ED,ED(plural of twice the first name of Harcourt as well as Sheeran, both singer-songwriters).
Defn: …, examples of/say, instruments with vibrating reeds in their mouthpieces.
22 In college, something for acting Head of English Language (6)
CREOLE : [C(abbrev. for “college”) + ROLE(something for acting/a part to be acted in, say, a play or film)] containing(In …) 1st letter of(Head of) “English“.
Defn: A mother tongue developed from a mixture of languages.
24 Deprived of wings aviator gets woman (4)
IRMA : “airman”(an aviator/a pilot) minus its 1st and last letters(Deprived of wings).
Superb puzzle. You might also mention that NINA is found in row 7….
Thanks Enigmatist and scchua
Not a pleasing puzzle for me – far too much “guess and then parse” (or not!). The theme clue I guessed early on, as I had the X and the first E, so it was almost certainly French. I didn’t see the thematic Ninas, of course, though I did look for ENABLE in the clues.
FOI and favourite was DYSPRAXIAS.
Very good, though I was annoyed to have missed the ‘clue Nina’ (last seen a month or so ago in The Times of all places) despite the helpful hint. I had no idea about FELO DE SE but most clues were surprisingly gettable (for Enigmatist!) and the more conventional ‘answer’ Ninas were a nice reward at the end.
Thanks to Enigmatist and scchua for blog and pics.
All very clever, but in a licking your own elbow sense for a brunchtime/lunchtime solver like me. Twigged the special instructions, so decided to give it a go, but should have realised that the engineering needed for the acrostic clues and the ninas was not going to make for a pleasurable sprint. One for the stayers.
Superb puzzle imo. I relied on wordplay for 7a as I either did not know the term or had forgotten it. I saw the message spelled out in the initial letters of the clues, but failed to pick up the other references/ninas.
If it’s a taster for the S & B get together in York later this month I’d better pack some extra Ibuprofen.
An interesting challenge. The OED has DYSPRAXIA as a mass noun so I would question the pluralisation.
Thanks for the very intelligent and helpful blog – several answers parsing above my pay grade … thought I did well for me to get 90% on an Enigmatist.
I’ve had a couple of weeks off on holiday, only occasionally dipping into puzzles, so not the easiest thing to come back to! I knew nothing of the theme so the occasionally forced clues and solutions didn’t do much for me I am afraid. Despite knowing nothing of “Harcourt”, “Sheeran” rang a bell and the answer was obvious enough so no complaints about parochial knowledge there from me. I did not like “gory” – the end of a thing is not the start and gory = murderous is weak. One of those where you put in the answer and still need the check button. “silkscreen” was good, as were a few others, but overall I found this too contorted, too evil a grid and a bit of a slog. Maybe my brain will have woken up by tomorrow’s prize. I hope…
As muffin@2, except I got bored and gave up on the last half dozen. Still can’t understand NARCOTIC.
Thanks scchua and Enigmatist
I enjoyed this very much – not as difficult as many Enigmatist crosswords – even the things I wasn’t sure I knew were fairly clued. I’m pleased to see that (rarely for me) I spotted the ‘letters’ at the beginning of the clues and so did get the Nina.
My particular favourite (out of several candidates) was the ‘not a large’ charwoman’ for the brilliant penny dropping moment
Thanks to Enigmatist for the crossword and scchua for the illustrated blog
What an extraordinary idea, gridfill & execution. I can’t begin to guess how long this took Enigmatist from soup to nuts but the result is really special. Thanks to him and scchua, nice weekend all
I filled in the grid finally and enjoyed it but I waited until this blog was up to fully appreciate it.
Fantastic stuff. Thanks Enigmatist and scchua.
Two to go in the NW and a mate drops in. Some hours and shirazes later, looked again, not clicking, so came here. Just as well, as I never would have got felo de se or gory. Did all the rest and quite enjoyed them but without the faintest idea what either the hint or the theme was about apart from it’s being a horse race. Oh well, next time, thanks both.
Meant to say, lovely pics as ever scchua, generous of you do that.
Thanks Enigmatist and scchua
Excellent puzzle, really enjoyed it.
TheZed @ 8, can you give an example of something that only has one end? Most linear things have a front end and a back end.
Whilst most went in relatively easily, that final 5 or so took a while. I did not know felo de se- never came up in my latin classes at high school. Entirely missed the ninas, but then do not at all follow horse racing either here in NZ or elsewhere. Having seen the parsing here for narcotic, think it quite clever and I do enjoy that galena is the lead(chief) supplier for Pb. I agree with TheZed that gory=murderous is weak, maybe bloodthirsty would have been better. thanks to Enigmatist and to scchua for the helpful and colourful blog.
Simon S @15 If I told you that, because of short platforms, you should go to the end of the train, would you sit up by the engine? If I said I was at the end of the crossword, would you think I have nothing in the grid? “end” is pretty unambiguous unless qualified, as is “start”. If we accept that words mean something when qualified, but present them without the qualifier then anything goes. It’s true that many things have 2 ends – though the circle line on the London underground has only one end now it is lasso-shaped – but when something is directional, it has a start and an end. Can you think of an example where “end” on its own explicitly means the start of something?
Oddly, I did notice ninal in line 7 and fleetingly thought, Interesting, adjectival form of nina; but then, as I said, the day happened.
Further to scchua’s fine pics, what a gorgeous one of the Ark; reminds to read Mrs ginf’s Patrick O’Brian series again (20 books! wonderfully bingeable).
@The Zed – as someone who has frequently had to deal with the vagaries of announcers at St Pancras, where the trains often line up end to end (pun intended), if you ask the guard which end of the train to get on to Canterbury, if he says ‘the end’, he will be getting a punch. Thus, they will often say passengers for X use ‘the end nearest the platform, passengers for Y use the end furthest away’. They are both ‘ends’. All you need to make the clue make sense is your admission that “it’s true that many things have 2 ends”. No more need be said. The fact that in your example about the crossword (just one of many thousands) it would make no sense is neither here nor there – in that particular example, ‘end’ means the opposite of ‘start’ – but there are multiple senses in which it doesn’t
Bingybing @19 my point about crosswords and English words is that they have a direction, from start to finish. Words are read left to right in English and so we conventionally talk about the start of a word and the end of it, not the two ends of it. We use the idea of two ends when the front and back are not obvious. To a train guard, the front and end of the train are obvious, as the front and end of a word in Japanese would be to someone fluent in reading kana. To you, less so perhaps and hence why the instruction appears ambiguous. I remain unconvinced by this clue!
What you guys are missing is that the verb end and the noun end aren’t used symmetrically. You can end it now.
Anyone notice that the grid had 6 Y’s, or that the clues had 3 periodicals?
TheZed @8 & 17
I think you have got hold of the wrong end of the stick.
Frankie the cat@6: DYSPRAXIA is a general term for a family of disorders, and in the field of speech-language pathology, anyway, people do talk about different dyspraxias (motor dyspraxia, dyspraxia of speech, etc.). So I don’t think there’s a problem with the plural use.
Chapeau to Enigmatist for a tour de force – what great setting!
Thanks also to scchua for some of the parsings; I suppose the circles are concentric i.e. one inside another in NARCOTIC.
I particularly liked the Head of English and the DYSPRAXIAS.
2d is a duff clue, and analogies not needed to show it. In order for “G OR Y” to be the answer to the question “How does GUY end?”, you need to be able to deny that the last letter in a word was its end. If you want to argue that a word has two ends, then the answer world be “G AND Y”. A miss both ways.
I thought this was going to be tough, and I was right. That said I nearly got there with only 7a missing, therefore a DNF here. Never heard the term but annoyed with myself because I had ode pencilled in but missed the anagram indicator. That said despite some unfamiliar words, it was largely enjoyable, though I was another who missed the tips. A lot of misdirection in this and my favourite was Yemeni. Thank to both a Enigmatist and scchua.
How does guy end? With [a] G or [a] Y.
If a guy lies down, does he have a head end and a foot end? …
… I’ll get me coat.
Putting one circle inside another doesn’t necessarily mean that they are concentric!
An excellent puzzle. Like Frankie the cat @6, I had doubts about DYSPRAXIAS being a plural, but I take the point made by Iroquois @23, and I don’t have a problem with it now.
I too would have liked 2d worded a bit differently, but I can see how the clue works and cannot fault it.
I appreciated as much as everything else the ‘tips’ of the clues and the Nina, but I didn’t see any of that while solving. (I read the brief preamble but promptly forgot all about it.)
Many thanks to Enigmatist and Scchua.
Thanks both,
Like many, I suspect, the name of the setter told me we were in for torture or a treat. It turned out to be the latter. The wordplay of 20a was my favourite. I’m not convinced that eternal is a good definition for ‘steady’, but that is a mere quibble.
I always enjoy an Enigmatist challenge, although I do not believe I have ever solved one completely without recourse to aids, and this was no exception. DNF for me because I failed to get FELO DE SE which I did not know – I am kicking myself a bit because the wordplay was fairly obvious in the end – and IOWA, for which I need to administer an even bigger kick – one of fifty indeed; when will I learn!? Sadly I know someone suffering from DYSPRAXIA, so this was easy, if, for obvious reasons, not a favourite. And so like muffin because of the X, the theme answer was obvious although I have no interest in racing and know nothing of the jockey or horse. Favourites were CUCKOO (spring nuts lovely) and SALT MINE. Thanks to Enigmatist, and for the excellent blog which gave me all the gen on the Arc and the ninas to scchua.
But muffin, o is in the centre of arctic; very neat, I thought.
Good point, GinF
muffin @28: They are concentric if the inner circle is at the centre of the outer one, is is the case here with “O” being at the centre of “ARCTIC”!
beat me to it, GinF
Muffin @ 28
They are concentric because the O is exactly in the middle of ARCTIC.
Two of you have beaten me to it.
Dr. WhatsOn @21 very good point…”How does guy end?” With a “y”, unambiguously, as “end” is a verb here. It was certainly an odd fill, with a crossing “X” (appropriately) as well as all those “y”s. It felt as though the Scrabble score was quite high on this grid!
Very clever, and not as impenetrable as some Enigmatist puzzles seem. As a non-racing fan, the theme was largely wasted on me, and annoyingly CUCKOO was last in despite being one of the easier clues.
Thanks to Enigmatist and manehi
How did I get cardinal for 14 ac. Anagram of radical with n for new clergy is cardinal. Totally wrong of course
What else is there to add, but this was stunningly good.
Thanks to Enigmatist and Scchua
I was completely clueless (really) about where the references to Sunday’s big race were hidden though I did manage to finish all of this with after a mighty struggle. But the blog Enabled me to see it. Thanks Scchua! Hope Frankie is able to perform his flying dismount after a record breaking hat trick for his mount late afternoon at Longchamp on Sunday…
Like having an extra Prize crossword. Very enjoyable and an impressive act of compiling (and blogging). It led to some rarer words and phrases GLYCERYL, FELO DE SE, DYSPRAXIAS (can it be a plural?). Why couldn’t I find the hidden texts? Dettori, I knew of; Enable, I didn’t.
An excellent crossword that deserves all of the plaudits but 9a as parsed here is shockingly poor, clearly I’m out of step but to me ‘does double duty’ is a criticism not an explanation.
Was surprised to get 5,23 early on from just the enumeration and x.
Thanks to Enigmatist and Scchua
I’m going to be the spoilsport and say I didn’t enjoy this at all. I’ve: (1) never heard of the race (we have a completely different set of big horse races over here, and I don’t pay attention to those much either); (2) therefore never heard of the jockey or his horse; (3) never heard of a number of the entries. And the puzzle–as Enigmatist usually is–was too clever by half (as in, not clever in the fun way, but clever in the “make you suss out what the word has to be from its definition, and then maybe if you’re lucky, you can work out what the rest of the word salad in the clue is doing” way). I’d say “more a pleasure to set than to solve,” but it seems like the majority enjoyed it. So I’ll just leave it at that.
Just curious: did anybody recognize either nina when only partially-completed, fill the rest in, and use those extra letters to help complete those other answers? There always seems to be a kind of race in the event of a covert theme to identify the theme early enough to be helpful; I was wondering if that was anybody’s experience here, or was it all after-the-fact?
Not even that, Dr. Whatson. After I had guessed the race, I Googled the runners, but saw nothing of significance (I should have looked at the riders as well!).
However my only contact with horse-racing is a couple of long vacs working in a bookie’s back in the early 70s.
As more of a selling plater than a classic thoroughbred I also find Enigmatist has me ‘bunging first and parsing possibly’ more than is fun. Thanks anyway.
Dr.WhatsOn @ 36. No, and indeed like others I did not notice the nina until I came here and was alerted to it by clever Scchua!
Enigmatist’s puzzles are always difficult but usually fun. This was certainly difficult but I didn’t find it fun. Didn’t know the race so I looked it up and then proceeded to tease out the answers and mostly succeeded except for 2dn and 10ac which I didn’t and don’t understand. Rather too clever for me!
Thanks(begrudged) Enigmatist.
@Robert
to describe a clue as “shockingly poor” based on the parsing suggested by the blogger seems quite strong. FWIW, I don’t believe there is any double duty.
On a more general point, I rather get the impression that this kind of puzzle isn’t broadly welcomed by contributors here and that is a matter of great regret, in my opinion. Very rarely do I finish this setter’s puzzles and hardly ever do I uncover all the little tidbits he’s hidden about the place, but if Enigmatist wasn’t around how would I get better? If all we want is A* at GCSE and Monday ersatz Rufus puzzles (which were of course excellent for the remit) then that’s a bit of a shame.
baerchen @ 52:
I’m with you all the way on that.
And me!!!!
Mmmm – my preference is clues in which you can build up the answer from the wordplay, then confirm that the solution fits the definition. The majority (though, to be fair, not all) of these didn’t work that way – hence my “guess, then parse” comment earlier.
Unlike yesterday’s Paul, we liked this one, although can see why some did not. And the arguments regarding ends here is a lovely extra.
We think DISPRAXIAS unproblematic, and the concentricity of NARCOTIC splendidly pedant-proofed. Back to ends, my physicist friends talk of magnetic monopoles which, if they exist, presumably have one only?
As baerchen@11 says, an astonishing tour de force. Thank you both.
2d ignoring the quibbles about ends, what I disliked about this is the equating of gory and murderous. I agree with TheZed on that.
@Jenny @TheZed
OK but you’d better complain to Collins, which has gory=murderous, rather then Enigmatist
Yes, “bloody” would have been better.
I’m getting increasingly dubious about “it’s in such-and-such a dictionary”. Is it not possible that dictionaries are just wrong? I say unto to you “epicentre”!
Dr Whatson @46
I’ve already commented that I saw nothing of the theme until I’d finished. But I would make the general point that what you describe is my idea of an ‘ideal complete solve’ – I get so far, I discover some thematic items, they help me with more clues and so on to a finish. If a puzzle was always like that, though, I would perhaps begin to crave some variety, and it’s a different sort of challenge to find that the theme doesn’t reveal itself until near the end. I missed out on the thematic content completely, but I was still 100% satisfierd with the puzzle and admired particularly the message that I missed in the ‘tips’ of the clues.
@muffin
Indeed. Latte=coffee? Complete cobblers
And indeed in my ancient Chambers a loudspeaker is described as a device for amplifying sound, which is a loudhailer. A loudspeaker is a transducer, converting electrical signal to sound. Completely wrong. But then it also defines an eclair as a cake long in length, but short in eating, which is supremely correct.
I, too, am not happy with “I justify this on the grounds that a single dictionary gives this equality”. We are users of the amazing, varied and complex English language, not computers.
baerchen @62: your example reminds me of having breakfast in Rome next to a loud British family who were complaining. They’d ordered “a cafe and a latte” and were shocked to get a tiny cup of espresso and a glass of milk. Ask and ye shall receive…
in my part of the world ‘nogger’means football. It’s not in a dictionary. If I used it as a solution I suspect, Mr Muffin, that you would alter your view on the importance of having a reference work that setter and solver can generally agree on as standard
This was just tremendous.
We saw the special instructions, then forgot about it.
While we noticed (early on) that it was about horse racing – and not for the first time with this setter – we missed everything that was part of that theme.
So, no hidden messages for us.
Far from dictionaries, it took us about an hour and a half to get everything right.
Everything? Not really.
We failed on the crossing 2d and 7ac.
7ac’s FELO DE SE we would never have unearthed – not in a million years, totally unknown.
But hey, enough accessible clues to keep you going.
A special +++++ for the concentric circles in 16d!
Lovely crossword.
And for those who didn’t like it (at all), there will always be a next Monday or Tuesday.
Many thanks to scchua & Enigmatist.
Like Sil@66, I failed on 2d and 7ac, but apart from that though it was a hell of a workout and a tremendous puzzle. Many thanks to E & s.
Thanks to Enigmatist and sschua.
I didn’t give too much time to this as I was having a muffin@2-like experience: got the central clue and then slowed to a canter, a trot, a walk, a twellwithit. But I did enjoy what I uncovered, incl FELO DE SE (really? – fell on it like a hawk on a tit no problem; just goes to show), REEDED (lowering of eyes and fidgeting with cap while suggesting that the blog leads to REEDS?) and IOWA/IRMA.
Should I be surprised that the ILK of SILKSCREEN didn’t get more of a pedants’ gauntlet? – doesn’t matter as many in fine form and much entertainment in the many contributions. And yes, just because a dictionary supports a word doesn’t mean it would stand up under canon law (holy writ is what I’m working towards here) c.f. my many objections to the likes of “emcee”, “deejay” and “kayo”.
Muffin,
I had a similar problem earlier in the week, when Drambuie was classed as a cordial. Just because the dictionary says a cordial can be a sweet alcoholic drink.
mrpenney@45 and baerchen@52…
I think I am somewhere in between. There is no doubt Enigmatist is a top-notch setter and I await his puzzles and enjoy the challenge; use aids to complete; and learn.
This one esp, to get clues arranged in that order, pick a grid that’d work, and incorporate the nina and, have an opening to theme, with an anagram, that has a sensible surface…only a grand master can do it.
That said 5,23 and 21d etc are specialised and parochial…one some times wishes a themeless, UKGK less clean challenges from setters like him.
In that, our Maskarade puzzles are also somewhat like this..double grid, jigsaw etc.
They are also fun, but one wishes clean challenges without the surrounding gymnastics…
I sense the frustration of mrpenney, and also agree with baerchen and others, including me, who liked this puzzle in spite of my own inability to solve this without aids.
A boring plod
Wendybea @ 71
That’s enough about your local policeman. What did you think about the puzzle?
For me, this was (to paraphrase 71) an excellent plod. I gave up on gory and yemeni (turns out my parsing thoughts were all wrong, so fair enough), but got the rest, despite it taking me all day, on and off. Narcotic was superb. I got 5/23 early, but don’t follow horses so had no help from the theme, but on reading the blog, wow, what a piece of work!
Applause to Enigmatist, and thx to scchua.
maybe someone meant Maskerade whan saying “a boring plod”
Hey, would I say a thing like that?
Alphalpha@68, I’ve edited the blog to what I really meant in the wordplay of 21 down.
baerchen@52, your comment made me think again, and I’ve added another parsing for 9 across
Like Mrpenny and others I didnt enjoy this at all and gave up half way. I mean who’s ever heard of ‘felo de se’? And the clue to ‘gory’, one of the few I got: How does it end? G or Y? G is not the end, it’s the beginning. But that is all it could be. I did enjoy 6 down and a few others, but generally too contorted for my tastes
Not sure why Wendybea’s comments that the crossword was a boring plod should be met with sarcasm rather rebuttals confirming its brilliant excitement. There are plenty of comments above from people dissatisfied with the solving experience they have with Enigmatist puzzles – ie, stripping out the cryptic content to identify the definition parts of the clues and converting it into a quick crossword. Kudos to those who have a mind that can deal directly with the cryptic content rather than admire it as an afterthought. But there are plenty of us who (for a crossword attached to a newspaper) prefer something more approachable. Horses for courses.
Baerchen @ 52 Probably a bit late but… As an outright comment on the clue I would agree that it isn’t justified but I was quite deliberate with my wording and the caveat that I was commenting on the clue as parsed here.
If the clue really has an missing element with the intention that solvers should add/reuse a word without any indication or justification then it is objectively poor, if we are to believe that Enigmatist deliberately wrote it that way or that experienced solvers can casually accept that as a valid technique then I find it shockingly poor.
My view on the clue itself is that I (like everyone else apparently) am probably missing something clever in 9a, my view on ‘this type of puzzle’ is that more would be very welcome and my view on your more general point is that it sounds more like a prejudice you brought with you than an opinion based on the comments in this thread.
p.s. can anyone with a mathematics / computing bent can find a way to link ‘arity’ with ‘object of quest’ ?
Well, we got BODY instead of GORY (BOD for guy, Y for how it ends and whole thing &lit.
Found really hard and plodded, never twigged felo de se. Thank you for really clever puzzle, Enigmatist, and have no idea how Scchua managed to blog it.
For 9a, while solving I didn’t give it too much thought, just noting the apparent double duty, but now I like the whole clue as def. theory. I think ‘In the light’ must mean ‘the solution is’ (i.e. what you should put in the light in the grid), with ‘dealer’s ultimate object of quest’ being the def for rarity.
Thanks Enigmatist, sschua
James @ 81 I wondered if it was meant as an &lit with ‘of quest’ as a qualifier after the wordplay elements to make it work, but would that require a question rather than exclamation mark?
4d How many solvers said to themselves “great strker – that must be LARA and city – that must be YORK”? I prefer clues that I have at least some hope of solving without crossers.
Pino @ 83
Interesting question.
I find that in general my solving is multiple permutations of seeing through the wordplay; mentally (de)constructing an anagram, charade or embed; or with the help of a couple of crossers thinking “that fits, I wonder if it parses”. And the Venn Diagram of the three varies both between setters and within their puzzles.
Dr Whatson at 46, that is exactly what happened to me. When I spotted the partly completed Frankie Dettori, I then completed it and that helped me get 6 clues that I had been stuck on.
Simon S @ 84
Yes, we all use different routes to a solution and most, I suspect rely heavily on crossers. I do prefer it when wordplay is of some assistance in solving, not just a method of validating a clue. I suspect that in this case Enigmatist was expecting us to solve the clue as a CD, assisted by the numeration. LARA was a misdirection – most would surely look for a footballer as a striker and Lara was a great batsman, but not a great striker in the sense of Viv Richards, Gayle, or even Stokes. It would take a long time going through a list of cities before reaching YORK. I doubt if I was the only one to start with EC.
Pino @ 87
Knowing that John Henderson lives in York might push it higher up the list of possibilities…
Thanks to scchua and Enigmatist
No need for double duty in 9a.
Both Chambers and Collins give QUEST as a noun meaning “object of a search”
I take the exclamation mark as an indication that the def is slightly stretchy, but as there is no need to go in search of what’s common, not very.
I print puzzles and catch up with them later. I just did this one. Following the instructions I went straight to Prix de l’Arc de Triomphe (shouldn’t 5d be 4,2 1 3?), easy enough. Then the acrostic. After that I found the theme no help whatsoever. What is this ‘nina’ which some cite?
As with some others I filled in most of the solutions from the definitions. Convoluted clues are all very well I suppose, but they get tedious after a while. Someone mentioned Rufus. Easy enough I know, but always elegant. Araucaria the Great managed that in testing puzzles, and Paul can do it too. Some of the others are getting there I think, but as you might gather, I didn’t appreciate this one at all.