Guardian Cryptic 28,519 by Brendan

93 comments on “Guardian Cryptic 28,519 by Brendan”

1. Plenty to enjoy in this puzzle. My favourites: STOAT, MALEFACTOR, GIANTS, NONSENSE, ID EST, NON-PROFIT, HITS, ANIMAL FARM.

   New for me: PRIEST – fishing club/tool for killing fish; THRIFT = plant / sea pink.

   Thanks, both.

2. I thought this was a fine puzzle, technically, just not that much fun to do – presumably because there were only one or two choices for the parse structure in most clues. Maybe it was fun on the setting side: given an answer, seeing if it could be clued in two or three words. Still, if you were looking for a light end-of-weekend/beginning-of-week challenge, then this would fit the bill admirably.

3. Some nice pithy clues… although I got it all I had a few guesses. I struggled to justify PIRATING because neither half of the charade was familiar. Is “murphy”=”tater” one of those things that we should be wary of being tied up with ethnic/national stereotypes? I know “paddy wagon” is now frowned on, but then that obviously has more negative connotations.

4. Interesting: I found Pan and his quiptic (twice as difficult with clues twice as long) – as Brendan with his cryptic (half as difficult with clues half as long) – but both of exactly equal enjoyment. This must surely prove something. Any suggestions from fellow bloggers? Conservation of entropy? Or what?

5. rodshaw@4 maybe someone should do a study of a collection of “difficult” clues and see if they are notably longer than the average. There may be something to it.

6. Great idea, Dr. Whatson@5. I’m usually in favor of tautology versus verbosity (nothing annoys me more than a twenty-word clue for a three-word answer). But it takes all types …

7. Admirable in its austerity but I agree with Dr.WhatsOn @2 that this crossword was “not that much fun to do.” Still I found enjoyment with NONSENSE and STOAT among other clues. Thanks to both.

8. Thrift the plant vaguely familiar, priest the fish club not at all (but I like the idea … rather than the poor things gasping, a quick dispatch is merciful). Despite their recurrence, took ages to remember key/isle and exactly/to a t, so the NE was last in. Also thought non-profit was just a dd … d’oh. But yes, generally this Brendan lite was nice for Monday, thanks both. Oh and yes like PeterO, felt the chemists wincing at compound=mixture.

9. Thanks for the amusement Brendan. I was astonished to find all the clues were two or three words long. I don’t think I have run into such a brevity before. That means they were very precise and that made it a very good Monday puzzle.
   I too looked at the compound/mixture pair and groaned a little. Unfortunately Chambers sticks mixture in the first definition of compound as an adjective.
   The rest slotted in pretty well.
   Thanks for the explanations PeterO.

10. Enjoyed the concise cueing. That definition of PI is a new one on me!

11. Clueing even (damned autocorrect!)

12. I wonder if PostMark, when contemplating a change of identity, ever considered EURO as an option? (Not that I’m suggesting he’s semi-neurotic.)

    [Incidentally, it must be getting on for a year now since he disambiguated himself – since when the ambiguators seem to have disappeared!]

    ginf @8: likewise – never heard of priest in the fish-killing sense, but agree the quicker the better. There’s a comparison of slaughter methods here. ‘Percussive stunning’ is described as ‘the optimal technique for humane slaughter’, although on the down side ‘a manually applied club generates operator fatigue and can lead to imprecise or insufficiently strong blows’.

    I see from wiki that the name ‘priest’ comes from the notion of administering the last rites, and also that it has featured as a murder weapon in both Dalziel and Pascoe and Father Brown.

    Back to the crossie – nobody has yet mentioned ‘Calf’s state’ as a favourite, but it was mine. What with ANIMAL FARM and SNOWBALL I was suspecting something Orwellian, but Napoleon never showed up.

    Since Brendan went for the brevity option this morning, I thought I’d go the other way. 😉 Thanks to him and PeterO.

13. A very clever crossword but I’m with Dr Whatson @2: it wasn’t that much fun.

    STOAT was clever. Thanks Brendan and PeterO

14. [Ben@3, re the humble spud and murphy (not to mention the latter’s law), the whole issue of stereotyping the ‘other’ is a fascinating one. It seems to be universal: the Irish jokes (I wouldn’t start from here), Lancashire v Yorkshire, Tuscans calling Calabrians banditi and Sicilians Arabi, and so on and on. At the ‘normal’ level its intention is humorous, but its humour depends on put-down. Is it a slippery slope to hate-speech? Hmm, wicked question]

15. I loved the brevity and it fits so easily on a screen!
    As a chemist I have no problem with COMPOUND in the general sense of a mastic or adhesive for example.
    Like essexboy, I wondered if it was going to be Orwellian.
    Thanks to Brendan and PeterO.

16. [eb @12: I don’t do anything by halves

    And I don’t know which washing powder gets rid of marks but I do appear to be the stubborn one 😀 ]

    I think Dr WhatsOn has set the tone for one school of comments today and that includes me. Clever and suited to Monday though not as easy as some we’re used to. I’m a little surprised there hasn’t been more comment on a couple where I feel Brendan’s status is letting him get away with things. For me ANIMAL FARM and TWO SEATER are decidedly dodgy – I’m not sure we’d have let Vulcan get away with that – and I’m not wholly convinced by NONSENSE but it’s probably just me. Otherwise, a masterclass in brevity. Four favourites, all in the first half dozen – CARNATION, STOAT, AGAINST and, COTD, NEW JERSEY.

    Thanks Brendan and PeterO

17. The easiest and most reliable way to tell a STOAT from a weasel is the tail. A stoat’s tail is around half the length of its body and ends in a bushy black tip. A weasel’s tail is short and stubby by comparison and solely brown in colour. So a weasel is weasely recognised, and a stoat is stoatally different!

    essexboy @12 Yes, I remember a bloke getting bopped on the bonce by a priest which wasn’t Father Brown.

    Thanks Brendan and PeterO

18. [Penfold@17. One is Weasely identifiable, the other is Stoatally different (sorry)].

19. A clever idea for a Monday slot crossword. At first sight I found it hard to get started but the insertion clues (egLICIT) were extra easy with only 3 words and then it was pretty smooth. I liked STOAT and the sanctimonious seaman but made a meal of ISLE even though aisle was my first thought on seeing passage. Mentally running through all the options on my keyboard.
    I’m glad to learn about the PRIEST club. I was worried about pries for fishing and T for club!
    Thanks Brendan. I good start on the week and to PeterO for an early blog.

20. [Penfold@17 I’ve never heard of blokes getting bopped on the bonce, although I heard saw a drive-by shouting once]

21. Thanks Brendan and PeterO. I find this surprisingly difficult – which I put down to struggling to get my brain in gear on a Monday morning. I mean, how on Earth could it have taken me so long to spot CARNATION, for example? Need more coffee…

    PostMark – I disagree on TWO-SEATER, which I think is a brilliant cryptic definition. But I agree on NONSENSE – I’m still not convinced by the parsing suggested by PeterO, can’t help feeling there’s something we’re all missing here.

    Also very much enjoyed STOAT and NEW JERSEY. Witty and inventive.

22. I must admit to being a little disappointed today, like several above, I usually enjoy Brendan’s work more.

    However, a nice gentle start to the week and some very precise clueing in very few words, which might be proof that brevity is the soul of wit.

    Thanks Brendan and PeterO.

23. [Widdersbel@21

    I imagine you were relieved to see rating for sailor 😉 ]

24. Ben @3 – I think Brendan gets a pass on that one, being Irish himself.

25. Blah @23 – you’re not wrong!

26. If you read PeterO’s explanation as “points with nothing in it”, I think the parsing for 7 is clearer.

27. Thanks Brendan and PeterO
    A masterpiece of brevity. Enough clues raised a smile for me to find it enjoyable – favourites were STOAT, NEW JERSEY, ADMIRED, and GIANTS.
    Sorry Auriga – I’m a retired chemistry teacher, so “mixture” for COMPOUND really jarred!

28. @various above

    I parsed NONSENSE as NO = empty (as in lack of…) then the points NSENSE.

    Compound adhesives and fillers are very common in construction and they are a mixture of usually two separate substances which harden or expand or do whatever they’re designed to do when mixed.

29. Thanks for the blog. Refuse waste ( 7 )

30. Thrift, the plant, is perhaps better known as sea pink.

31. Several I couldn’t parse, but they turned out to be quiet clever, e.g. “to a T”.

    I really can’t see how company car = two seater works as a cryptic definition. Almost all cars (the only counter example I can think of is the Messerschmitt bubble car) have at least two seats, so you can have company in all cars. Am I missing something?

32. Ravenrider@31

    Think of the old saw “Two’s company, three’s a crowd”

33. @various re TWO-SEATER. I too was dubious at first, until I remembered the phrase “Two’s company, three’s a crowd.”

34. [Snap!]

35. Well, I enjoyed it. Trust Brendan to come up with something different!

    I liked STOAT, NEW JERSEY, MANOR, GIANTS, ISLE, TATER, PIRATING and EURO.

    That’s how I interpreted ‘company car’, too, but lost my internet access as soon as I’d typed my post.

    Thanks to Brendan and PeterO.

36. Although kid’s science (KS 3) labours the difference between compound and mixture, general usage makes them the same, as in the examples given above.

    As muffin says, a masterpiece of brevity … but not the soul of wit.

37. I enjoyed this, though failed to parse a couple. Didn’t notice the brevity until it was pointed out. I tend to just focus on one clue at at time and never spot themes. That said, MANOR is a third AF reference, so how many constitutes a theme?

38. Thanks Brendan and PeterO

    I think Lily the Pink’s Medicinal Compound gets Brendan off the hook.

39. I enjoyed this puzzle for the concision of its clues. Mostly very straightforward, but it is Monday after all. STOAT was clever, and my LOI, and I had to check the weaponised meaning of PRIEST.

    This chemist has no problem with COMPOUND = ‘mixture’ – although now a bit archaic (except for construction, as Blah @28 points out) the term was used widely for a mixed preparation put together for a particular purpose. Many patent medicines were named ‘compounds’. According to the OED the word first appears in Middle English as an adjective, and the usage as a noun dates from the 1500s. The specific meaning in chemistry must have come along later.

40. Bit slow on the uptake this morning (something to do with spending the weekend wallowing in mud of biblical proportions – when one steps out of the Portaloo and wonders if one’s foot will ever stop sinking you know it can only be a August in Britain) so this took a while.

    I’m with others on the clue-length – there’s short and there’s THIS! COTD has to be TATER and I’m reminded of the brand of crisps in Ireland (North and South although different companies) called “Tayto” who do a mean Cheese and Onion flavour…

    Thanks Brendan and PeterO!

41. Gervase @39 – that’s today’s earworm sorted, thanks… https://youtu.be/2x8D4T–0v4

42. Was the remit no more than three words per clue? Including the hyphenated semi-neurotic. Have to admit that I couldn’t get GIANTS, inserting a rather feeble Fiends. So strictly a DNF, but unlike one or two others I thought this great fun and a proper Monday challenge…

43. Is there a word for the tendency of scientists to take words in wider usage since before science was invented, restrict their meaning, and then get cross when people carry on using the words as they always have? If not, the number of times it happens on this site suggests the time is ripe.

44. I never did enough chemistry to know about the difference between mixture and compound (whatever it is). However, the chief difference between a weasel and a stoat isn’t the tail: it’s the size. Weasels are tiny, like a long mouse.
    Not that fond of the minimalist clues, clever though they are, but it was a nice change from the usual Monday.
    Enjoyed STOAT, NEW JERSEY, EURO, but couldn’t quite get the parsing for NONSENSE or NON-PROFIT. If there are any more ANIMAL FARM references I can’t see them.

45. [Gervase@39: I well remember the bottle of (usually pink) disgusting stuff from the chemist’s shop, labelled The Mixture.]

46. Anyone else Celia for 13 down?
    Thanks B & PO

47. I parsed PRIEST as pries (is fishing) + t, which I thought must be some kind of club. As rodshaw said, an interesting contrast of styles with the Quiptic. NEW JERSEY was my favourite. I enjoyed this more than Dr Whatson did, but perhaps not as much as I have some of Brendan’s other puzzles. Thanks, both.

48. Good idea, VW@43. We could start with a list of the offending pairs (current/tide? Hmm … not quite), see if a collective noun suggests itself, then add ‘ers’, ‘ists’ or other ‘doers of’ ending.

49. I did like NEW JERSEY and NONSENSE, although the latter was a bit contrived for a Monday. However, I did find the crossword a bit lacklustre, although maybe that was the brief.

    Thanks Brendan and PeterO.

50. Cnutists for VW@43 . Hope I spelt that correctly.

51. I parsed NON-PROFIT as a simple double definition of ‘Unremunerative’ and ‘amateur match’. Nobody in an amateur match makes a profit.

    Thanks Brendan and PeterO.

52. VW et al
    I chose my description carefully – I said it jarred, not that it was wrong.

53. VW @43: I cannot for the life of me remember where (and Google has not helped), but I have somewhere seen the term ‘propriety semantics’ used to denote the process whereby a word or a set of terms is appropriated by a particular group of users to mean only what it means within their discourse, to the exclusion of other or previous meanings. I am afraid, however, that this does not yield a neat collective noun for those who practise it.

54. Me @53 – ‘proprietary’ of course – alas, my proofreading!

55. The theme seems to be that the 3-word clues are nearly all what3words locations somewhere in the Kalahari desert.

56. As Simon S says-efficacious in every way

57. Brevity is to be admired. Admirable change of style, but all too brief a diversion I’m afraid.

    Thanks both

58. [Magor @55 Yes, it did read a bit like that, although ‘animal.succeeded.exactly’ is in New South Wales and ‘leap year.partly. is in Alaska.]

59. Great crossie. Thanks Brendan and Peter O, for the one I couldn’t parse:
    PRIEST – from dictionary definitions. a ‘persuader’ ( criminal connotation methinks, and a religious one as well) or ‘administering the last rites’? If I had to choose, I’d choose the former.
    In my limited experience I’ve seen this done in fish markets and Chinese restaurants with a lobster. But I remember thinking, how humane, or fish friendly, or whatever the word is. Better than putting a crustacean alive in a freezer to supposedly send it to sleep without pain, so you have a better texture, rather than boiling it madly (alive or not) and ending up with something chewy.

60. Lovely start to the week. Thanks Brendan and PeterO for clearing up a few puzzles.
    (My Dad died over 30 years ago. He was an expert at ‘Dad’ jokes of which the weasel/stoat difference was one of his favourites. Thanks for reminding me of that today.)

61. paddymelon @ 59

    How do you kill a fish with a lobster?

    I’ll get mi coat…

62. Enjoyed this as a start to the week. Even though I put Ratte in rather than Tater initially.

63. Trust Brendan to come up with something amazing in another of his most enjoyable crosswords.

    Thanks to him and PeterO

64. Stambridge @46
    Yes, I’m another CELIA for 13 dn.
    Thanks Brendan and PeterO.

65. Excellent. Loved the brevity.

66. Spooner’s Catflap @53. The collective noun you have been seeking, was nailed by Roz @ 50,

67. I’ve never seen “smatter,” only “smattering.” So Miriam Webster online gives the definition of “smatter” as “to speak with spotty or superficial knowledge.” News to me. So is the fish-killing priest.

    We had “to a t” in a recent puzzle, anyone remember? (It may have been a Quiptic or an Everyman.)

    I for one had a nice time with this puzzle — thank you Brendan and PeterO.

68. Thanks PeterO for the PRIEST and various others for fleshing out NONSENSE and the TWO SEATER. I struggled with this after a couple of weeks off but enjoyed the conceit, especially being misled by GIANTS, parsing the sneaky STOAT and was delighted to finally spot a non-transcendental PI. Thanks Brendan.

69. Well who knew a Priest was a weapon for whacking fish. Bunged Celia in for CALLA but otherwise ok though unable to parse NONSENSE. Picks for me were STOAT, MUSHROOM & TWO SEATER.
    Enjoyed it, though if I’m honest not as much as Pan’s Quiptic.
    Thanks all

70. Thanks – THRIFT ADMIRER

71. [Muffin@27
    It all depends on context. In the same way I wouldn’t object to the general use of “reduction” to mean something other than lowering the oxidation state.]

72. [See also VW@43.]

73. I share general agreement with Van Winkle @43, and applaud Roz’s suggestion @50, which makes it difficult for her to continue to claim a lack of imagination. 🙂

    I can remember thrift depicted on the reverse of the old three-penny bit, but I see that this design was in fact discontinued before I was born. Quite a few must have remained in circulation, I guess.

    I sympathise with those who wrote CELIA at 13d – I was toying with CILLA for a while, but neither answer uses every element of the clue, as far as I can see, whereas CALLA does. I’m impressed by Brendan’s concise and accurate cluing, though I’m still a little unconvinced by NONSENSE.

74. Oh dear, after completing a Paul prize and yesterday’s Everyman, I approached today with confidence, but got nowhere. A style of cluing that was lost on me.
    Thanks both.

75. I really enjoyed this – a nice change. Favourite was New Jersey.

    HoofItYouDonkey @74:

    I’ve been doing the Guardian Cryptic for over 20 years now, and there are still a couple of setters I struggle with more than I should. A setter’s style makes a big difference, and often the ones I struggle with I find I should have got when reading the blogs here. I found this fairly tough – I usually like a little more to work with.

76. Absolutely brilliant!

77. I enjoyed that! Thank you Brendan and PeterO for explaining why NON PROFIT was better than I thought.
    I spent too long on 25D trying to make LUKE Mark’s successor.

78. Aargh! Why is ‘succeeded’ S?

79. S stands for “succeeded” in genealogy, I believe.

80. MarkN @75 Indeed, even in the days of doing the Telegraph I struggled with Brendan. Silly really, everything was beautifully clued, just a bit of a mental block.

81. I enjoyed this thanks to Brenden and PeterO. Forgive me if someone has already mentioned this and I have missed it, but so many of the clues remind me of the newish address system where the world is divided into 3 x 3 metre squares and each square is given a unique three letter nomination. My ‘address’ for instance is wept.shimmered.hopes. The system is called what3words and is beginning to be introduced!

82. [SPanza @81: good to see you! (It seems like it’s been a while.) As you suspected might be the case, you weren’t the only one to think of what3words – see Magor @55 and Penfold @58, who pointed out that leap.year.partly is in Alaska. It’s not a place I want to go. My screen turned completely white when I first entered the words. Repeatedly zooming out finally revealed a settlement called Coldfoot, then a little more and Arctic Village came into view. Brrrr.]

83. Very impressed by all clues 3 words or less. Quite the achievement. Reminds me of the conciseness of anax, though I can’t remember if he achieved this.

    Seems like Brendan keeps setting new challenges for himself. Bravo

84. Indeed, totally agree, Dutch.
    When I initially looked at the grid, I even thought that the Guardian had forgotten to include a preamble – it was that unusual.
    It is very difficult to set a puzzle like this, and surely one that avoids chestnuts.
    Some may find that this is more a “setter’s crossword” than one for the solver but I loved it.
    For the solver in me, it was over all too soon but lacklustre or not much fun to solve? Don’t think so.
    Another ‘Bravo’ here!

85. Thanks essexboy @81 I tend to lurk these days. And my apologies to Magor and Penfold for not reading their posts carefully enough. I wonder when all mail will be addressed to what3words, I’m sure it will come eventually!

86. essexboy@82 Believe it or not, I have actually been to Coldfoot — on my way North. It’s truck stoop on the haul road, the road the oil company built to enable themselves to get to the oilfields on the North Slope. I was there with my brother and a few workmates heading north for Toolik Lake, a research station where the University of Alaska does research on Arctic biology. It was in late August, so it wasn’t very brrrr at all, but very light — I never saw the sun go down the week or so I was up there, though I’m told it dipped below the horizon at 3am or so. At Coldfoot they sell T Shirts saying “Coldfoot Alaska, the world’s northernmmost truck stop,” and I bought the tackiest one I could find. Do google both Coldfoot AK and Toolik Lake for some more odd tidbits.

    Enjoyed the puzzle too. Thank you, Brendan and PeterO.

    Valentine

87. ooops — I meant “it’s a truck stop.”

88. [Many thanks Valentine @86; how spooky is that? I followed your advice and googled Coldfoot, so I can now tell you that the population at the last census was exactly 10, and furthermore that “north of Coldfoot, there are no services for 240 miles, until Deadhorse” (!)

    Even more spookily… SPanza @85, if the day does come when all mail is addressed to what3words, then whatever you do remember the ‘s’ on the end of your location. Any post addressed to wept.shimmered.hope will arrive at a 3 x 3 metre square approx. 20 miles east-south-east of Coldfoot – which is only 20 miles west of leap.year.partly !]

89. I’m with Dr. WhatsOn @ 2 – technically a fine achievement but not much fun to solve. Far too reminiscent of Times crosswords in the 1970s for me – the answer either comes to you or it doesn’t, and if it doesn’t there isn’t much parsing to juggle with. Hopefully we’ll be back to more normal clues tomorrow. Thanks to PeterO and to Brendan

90. [Yes essexboy that is spooky!! As I reported in these pages on 12/02/21 my Spanish address is giblet,give,explored!!]

91. I found the succession of terse clues a bit confronting.

92. Never seen to a t as a thing nor priest as a club and didn’t parse nonsense.
    Thanks both.

93. Appropriators

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