Guardian 28,606 / Crucible

It’s always a pleasure to see Crucible’s name on a puzzle and this one didn’t disappoint.

There seems to be a mini-theme of numbers running through the clues, with the central 16ac giving me some pause for thought but I (almost) got there in the end.

Favourites today were SMIDGEN, because I like the word, GAROTTE, MAMMOTH, GARGANTUAN, FOUR-EYES, TEN TO THREE, for its several associations and MORSEL, because I like the books and John Thaw.

Thanks to Crucible for a fun puzzle.

Definitions are underlined in the clues.

 

Across

9 Daisy and Bruce playing with a kid (9)
RUDBECKIA
An anagram (playing) of BRUCE and A KID for this daisy

10 Old film about tango that shows right amount of spirit (5)
OPTIC
O (old) + PIC (film) round T (Tango – NATO alphabet)

11 A little nipper trapped between poles (7)
SMIDGEN
MIDGE (nipper) in N S (poles)

12 Execute dance, with Romeo standing in for Victor (7)
GAROTTE
GA[v]OTTE (dance) with R (Romeo) replacing v (Victor) – more from the NATO alphabet

13 Consider route taken as read (5)
WEIGH
Sounds like (taken as read out) way (route)

14 My goodness! Typical Ascot gear’s time-consuming (5,4)
FANCY THAT!
FANCY HAT (typical Ascot gear) round (consuming) T (time)

16 Endless clues for Rod’s basket and tack (see below)
TWENTY-FOUR-SEVEN
The answer to 24ac is CREEL, which is a rod’s (angler’s) basket and to tack is to STITCH (the answer to 7dn) – I still don’t see why ‘see below’, since 7dn is above this clue but I’m sure someone will soon tell me

19 Greeting KL native of great height (9)
HIMALAYAN
HI (greeting) + MALAYAN (Kuala Lumpur native)

21 One’s message of dismay about gripping device? (5)
GISMO
A reversal (about) of OMG (text message of dismay) round (gripping) I’S (one’s)

22 Titters infuriated some bars at the end (7)
STRETTI
An anagram (infuriated) of TITTERS – some bars at the end of a composition

23 Massive flier covers a short distance (7)
MAMMOTH
MOTH (flier) round A MM (a millimetre, a short distance)

24 Catch container caught on rock (5)
CREEL
C (caught) + REEL (rock)

25 In stunned state, the Spanish call for leniency (9)
TOLERANCE
OLÉ (the Spanish call) in TRANCE (stunned state)

 

Down

 

1 Witch with warts transmogrified face with hands here (5,5)
WRIST WATCH
An anagram (transmogrified) of WITCH and WARTS

2 Clubs avoid habit-forming E number? (8)
ADDITIVE
ADDI[c]TIVE (habit-forming) minus c (clubs)

3 Measure litres then stupidly put in gallons (6)
LENGTH
L (litres) + G (gallons) put in an anagram (stupidly) of THEN

4 Hide small close relations (4)
SKIN
S (small) + KIN (close relations)

5 Huge fan carrying a horsey paper around (10)
GARGANTUAN
A reversal (around) of NUT (fan) round (carrying) A + NAG RAG (whimsically, horsey paper)

6 One needing help in looking for EU complex? Definitely (4-4)
FOUR-EYES
An anagram (complex) of FOR EU + YES (definitely)

7 Output of sewer a running sore? (6)
STITCH
Double definition, both of them cryptic

8 Area‘s excellent service stifling resistance (4)
ACRE
ACE (excellent service) round R (resistance)

14 Even in case of forgery one paper appears twice (5-5)
FIFTY-FIFTY
I (one) FT (Financial Times – paper) in F[orger]Y – twice

15 Poet’s time? It appears twice daily on one (3,2,5)
TEN TO THREE
This time appears twice daily on a WRIST WATCH (one down) and also in the last lines of Rupert Brooke’s poem ‘The Old Vicarage Grantchester:
‘Stands the church clock at ten to three?
And is there honey still for tea?’…
… which inevitably calls to mind Araucaria’s classic clue, “Poetical scene with surprisingly chaste Lord Archer vegetating (3,3,8,12)” which gives THE OLD VICARAGE GRANTCHESTER, ‘by a wondrous chance’, as Simon Hoggart said, Jeffrey Archer’s home

17 Revealing some material in Times earlier now and then (8)
TELLTALE
ELL (a measure of material) in TT (times) + eArLiEr

18 Six seconds matter for man of the house (8)
VISCOUNT
VI (six) + S (seconds) + COUNT (matter) – the house being the House of Lords, I think, so perhaps it should have a capital letter

20 Sleuth left very little to get his teeth into (6)
MORSEL
(Colin Dexter’s Inspector) MORSE (sleuth) + L (left)

21 Players more willing to join society (6)
GAMERS
GAMER (more willing) + S (society)

22 Ran away from rifle fire (4)
SACK
(ran)SACK (rifle)

23 Phone old boy missing race once (4)
MILE
M[ob]ILE (phone) minus ob (old boy) – I think the ‘once’ is there because races are now usually metric

71 comments on “Guardian 28,606 / Crucible”

  1. A wonderful puzzle, which took me a bit of time but was worth the effort. Hadn’t heard of RUDBECKIA, and only got it with the help of all the crossers. The clue for TEN TO THREE seemed a bit thin – I expected some fodder other than the reference to Rupert Brooke’s poem and the clock times. My favourites were somewhat similar to Eileen’s: SMIDGEN, MAMMOTH, FANCY THAT and MILE. Many thanks to Crucible and Eileen.

  2. Regarding ‘see below’, Eileen, I think that this just predicated on an assumption that a solver is, as I know some solvers do ( I don’t), reading all the across clues followed by the down clues, in which case both the 24ac and the 7d clues are textually ‘below’ the clue for 16ac, although the 7d solution is ‘above’ the 16ac solution. Well blogged; this was a toughie, I thought, and I am grateful to have been reminded of Araucaria’s wonderful Lord Archer clue.

  3. I started off well on this one and got about half without too much difficulty. Then I slowed down and the rest took quite a while and I used some help. But I did enjoy it and parsed most of them.

    Particularly liked: SMIDGEN (I also like the word), MAMMOTH, GARGANTUAN, FANCY THAT

    Thanks Crucible and Eileen (needed your help to parse a few)

  4. Well done Eileen for parsing TWENTY-FOUR-SEVEN and TEN TO THREE, I would never have deciphered those. I noticed that the diagonally opposed 22dn 8 dn gives another 23dn. I liked FOUR-EYES and HIMALAYAN .

    Ta Crucible & Eileen

  5. Thanks Crucible & Eileen, that was fun.
    In addition to the numbers and ‘times’ there are measures / containers of various kinds here too:
    ACRE, OPTIC, SKIN, SACK, SMIDGEN, MORSEL, STITCH, LENGTH, ELL, MILE
    and related adjectives: GARGANTUAN, MAMMOTH,
    and verbs: ADD, WEIGH, COUNT, TELL
    maybe more?

  6. I guess ‘see below’ might just mean that the clues to the other words are to be found below the current one.

  7. Thanks, Spooner’s catflap @2 – that makes sense (and I am, of course, one of those . 😉 )

    And thanks, wynsum @5 – I thought there was probably more than I was seeing.

  8. Thanks Eileen for the Rupert Brooke-a reminder of great talents being turned into cannon fodder.
    But hey-another great puzzle-and if it were not for the puzzle layout 7d should be below 16a
    I cant fault this puzzle-its been a very good Graun week
    Thanks DA too.

  9. Numbers, numbers. I enjoyed this – although I didn’t stop to parse one or two, the theme gave me confidence to insert the solutions.

    I liked FIFTY-FIFTY and the honeyed 15d, and the ‘nag rag’ raised a smile. The clue for GAROTTE is well done, but this procedure is so unpleasant that it cast a bit of a shadow over the rest of the solve for me.

    Slight correction to the blog: the ‘ace’ in the clue for ACRE is ‘excellent service’ (tennis).

    Thanks to Crucible and Eileen

  10. Tough puzzle. Solved upper half first.

    New for me: RUDBECKIA, SMIDGEN (I usually see it as smidgeon), CREEL.

    Favourites: GARGANTUAN, GAROTTE, HIMALAYAN, FANCY THAT, MORSEL, GISMO (loi).

    It took me a while to parse 16ac where 24/7 = endless, and 24ac CREEL + 7d STITCH = Rod’s/angler’s basket and tack).

    15d was at first unparsed apart from ‘it appears twice daily’ on a watch or clock. Google led me to a poem, The Old Vicarage, Grantchester by Rupert Brooke.

    Thanks, both.

  11. Thanks Eileen – I was hung up on reading TWENTY-FOUR-SEVEN as three clue numbers, and wondered what MORSEL-SKIN-STITCH had to do with it!

    And thanks to wynsum @5 for elaborating on the ‘measures’.

    And thanks to SC and peterM for ‘see below’.

    And thanks Tassie Tim for Peter Sellers.

    And thanks Crucible for a fun and satisfying crossword. The proximity of GA(r/v)OTTE and FANCY (t)HAT gave me my earworm for the day.

  12. Didn’t know RUDBECKIA or what ‘Poet’s time?’ at 15a was referring to. My favourites were the ‘horsey paper’ part of the wordplay for GARGANTUAN, FOUR EYES and FANCY THAT. I was interested to read of the possible themes which escaped me. The only thought I have about ‘(see below)’ for 16a is that the V (= vide = see) of SEVEN (once solved of course) is below and in line with 7d. No, I’m not convinced either! Spooner’s catflap @2’s explanation is more plausible.

    Thanks to TassieTim @7 for the reminder of and link to “Balham, Gateway to the South”. RIP Denis Norden.

    Thanks to Eileen and Crucible

  13. Thanks, Gervase @10 – a careless omission, now rectified.

    And many thanks to essexboy for the welcome earworm – that thought occurred to me as I wrote the blog. I love that number – the ‘frenzied moment’ always makes me laugh …

    … and to Tassie Tim for the Peter Sellers, which I was telling my grandson about when he took me on a tour of Bal-ham.

  14. Thank you, Eileen. As others, I would never have parsed the two long number clues and, notwithstanding SC’s spirited defence @2, I still find the see below aspect a little odd.

    Re STRETTI (pl of stretto) this has dozens of meanings in Italian but I’ve never quite understood how any of them relate to the bars at added at the end of a piece, often at a faster tempo. Perhaps a more accomplished linguist will elucidate.

    Satisfying crossword, many thanks to the fire-pot.

  15. The same thinking as essexboy in all respects. Bal-ham has made me confuse The Old Vicarage, Grantchester and Gray’s Elegy. Thanks all.

  16. Thought that WRIST WATCH was a bit of a giveaway to get things started – but, hey, I’ll take it. Needed Eileen’s explanations for the long clues that referenced it thereafter. Have to admit, however, that a DNF today, as I simply could not work out that M-L- for 23d would produce MILE with all that devious misdirection in the clueing. Was it as long ago as 1953 that Roger Bannister was smashing the four minute barrier for that…?

  17. Thanks very much to Crucible and Eileen. A very pleasing puzzle despite those couple of unfamiliars to begin – 9a RUDBECKIA (as for others, only solved via some crossers) and 10a OPTIC (in the sense of a spirit measure). Other than those, reasonably plain sailing, with tick after tick for great clues. I liked the numerical mini-theme. I think the afore-mentioned MORSEL at 20d was my favourite of all, but (ran)SACK at 23d was a candidate as well. While I “got” the definition, I didn’t understand the wordplay for 16a TWENTY-FOUR-SEVEN at all – and what an awkward surface! (Or is “basket and tack” a thing?) Thanks to contributors to the blog for some interesting takes on this solve.

  18. Most of this was good, tough, fun.
    For my taste, TEN TO THREE, while of course referencing Araucaria, is a bit unsatisfactory because either you know the Brooke poem or you don’t. And the wordplay for TWENTY-FOUR-SEVEN, which I failed to twig before reading the invaluable Eileen, teeters on the boundary between very clever and too clever by half.
    I’d always spelt a thingummybob as a GIZMO, and (heretically for a crossword lover I know) I can’t stand Dexter’s books so had a mental block about getting MORSE(L), so a DNF for me. But a lot of enjoyment in the process.
    Thanks to Crucible and Eileen.

  19. Thanks Eileen as I missed the cross-ref in TEN TO THREE, another stroke of genius from Crucible after TWENTY FOUR SEVEN led helpfully to CREEL (which gave me my earworm from the Beach Boys as I tried to equate rock and reel) – I just ignored the “see below” as I couldn’t see any point to it. Maybe got lucky with the two unknown words from anagrams but with the crossers there wasn’t much doubt.
    My grumble today is that like NeilH@21 I reckon GISMO should have a Z – and OMG is surely an expression of shock rather than dismay – so with the very cryptic grammar on top that was LOI and nearly not at all.
    But so much other dastardly trickery to enjoy, thanks Crucible.

  20. Is rudbeckia a daisy? I’ve never heard of it, but it’s not a daisy according to Wikipedia, though it does say the plant has a “daisy like efflorescence”, so maybe very loosely it could be.

  21. William@16 In a stretto at the end of a fugue, the fugal entries pile up in a more condensed and constricted way. Elsewhere, it may simply indicate a busier section towards the end of a composition, with more notes giving the impression of speed if not actually a faster tempo (although it often is), perhaps creating a bottleneck of notes?
    ravenrider@23 I think it’s in the same ‘aster’ family

  22. I was also puzzled for some time by the reference to 7d being “below” TWENTY FOUR SEVEN, which it so obviously isn’t, but of course it’s below in the list of clues, if not in the completed grid. Didn’t know that was what STRETTI were.
    Thanks Eileen for sorting out GISMO (which I spell with a Z and couldn’t parse), and thanks Crucible for a fun crossword.

  23. I enjoyed this very much although I needed Eileen to explain the parsing of several. As a resident of KL, but in my case King’s Lynn, it took me a while to get 19ac. Thanks to all.

  24. Well, if you look at Eileen’s wonderful blog, you’ll find the relative position of 7D. Thanks for the reminder of Araucaria’s Archer clue, and for explaining the numbers, which were lost on me, apart from 50-50. That reminds me about Picaroon’s superb ‘numbers’ Prize Puzzle – well worth a look if you haven’t seen it before.

    And, the crossword was good also, although I struggled a bit towards the end.

    Thanks Crucible and Eileen.

  25. William @16: As wynsum @25 says, ‘stretto’ in musical terminology (past participle of ‘stringere’, to bind, squeeze, grasp) indicates that the notes, or the theme and variations in the case of a fugue, are squeezed together. ‘Stretto’ is also the usual word for ‘narrow’ – the opposite ‘largo’ (wide, broad) is also used as a musical direction to mean ‘expansive’.

  26. wynsum @25 & Gervase @29: Bravi, that makes sense. I hadn’t considered it as the pp of stringere. Played stretti many times but this puzzle made me stop and think.

    Many thanks, both.

  27. Thanks Crucible and Eileen.

    Very enjoyable if occasionally tortuous (see above). I really enjoyed STITCH being clued as a “running sore”, best chuckle in a while – now to introduce it into conversation…..

    Inclined to wonder what process leads to the cluing of RUDBECKIA. It’s the first across clue and the surmise would be that it would be the first entry in the grid for the setter – why choose such an obscurity to kick off? Perhaps it was unavoidable as the crossword developed and GARGANTUAN proved indispensable and forced the final -A. A bit of a pimple on an otherwise alabaster puzzle but then I don’t set and it’s easy to carp.

  28. Like some earlier posters, I made a quick start then s l o w e d down. I got there in the end and the theme helped with some clues.

    Lots of good clues, as others have mentioned. LENGTH made me smile.

    Thanks Crucible for an engrossing puzzle and Eileen for the instructive blog.

  29. Just to lower the tone a bit I immediately thought 15 may refer to poets day “p*ss off early tomorrow’s Saturday”, sorry. Be surprised if Paul has never used it? Ta C & E for great crossword & blog.

  30. I found this toughish but fair. For some reason took ages to get GISMO. I’ll blame living on the left side of the pond for not immediately knowing what a E-number is: my first thought was Erdos number (mine is 3) but that had to be way too arcane, so had to look it up. After finishing, it occurred to me that maybe we’ve seen it here before, so I did a search here, and yes, it was in Aug 2019, also for ADDITIVE, also by Crucible, also blogged by Eileen. FANCY THAT!

  31. Spooner’s c@2 and Eileen @8 Whatever order you do the clues in, the down clues are below the across ones on the page. I agree about Araucaria’s wonderful clue.

    I think there’s a microtheme of time and timepieces.

    Lots of fun last night. Thank you, Crucible and as ever Eileen.

  32. Another enjoyable but tough puzzle. I liked the mini numerical theme; and the ear worm of the day from essexboy @12. Thanks to Crucible and Eileen.

  33. Thanks both,

    My theory is the ‘see below’ was just an editing instruction that failed to be deleted. My earworm of the day ‘It just takes a smidge(o)n to poison a pigeon in the park’. Rupert Brooke died of sepsis on a hospital ship and is buried in Skyros so was not literally cannon fodder.

  34. ‘See below’ did exactly what was intended for me. I already had creel, looked for and spotted the match between that and Rod’s basket and thus solved the clue.
    Otoh, could there be a less helpful bit of wordplay than ‘It appears twice daily on one’? If you’re looking for a time, it narrows down the possibilities literally not at all. What was Crucible thinking?
    I normally think of Crucible as a steady medium pacer, but plenty of variety today, to the good. Running sore for STITCH was funny, and GARGANTUAN very neat.

  35. Thanks Crucible for a well crafted crossword. I had many favourites including MAMMOTH, TOLERANCE (for once “the Spanish” was not “el” or “la”), LENGTH, STITCH, and FIFTY-FIFTY. I did have trouble with some of the parsing — 5d, 16a, and 15d were a mystery and I didn’t know “gavotte” for dance or OPTIC for “the right amount of spirit.” Many thanks to Eileen for furthering my education.

  36. Valentine @35: “Whatever order you do the clues in, the down clues are below the across ones on the page.” That must, I think, depend on the device on which you are accessing it. In my laptop’s interface, the down clues are set out as a list alongside the across clues; therefore, in this particular instance the clue for 7d is in fact spatially higher up the page than the clue for 16ac as well as the solution being spatially higher in the grid. I was therefore suggesting that the setter was using ‘below’ in the manner of intra-textual cross-referencing in academic writing, such that ‘see below, p.77’ would direct attention to a later elaboration of a point being made on, say, p.23.

    I personally would find having the down clues appearing below the across clues on the page intolerable, given the amount of scrolling required to check from clue to grid and back again.

  37. Thanks Crucible and Eileen. Like Picaroon yesterday, this was a real treat – completely agree with your assessment on all counts, but would add FANCY THAT and STITCH as favourites. Took me two sittings to finish it, but it was well worth the effort, with many smiles along the way.

    I got TEN TO THREE from the rest of the clue and the crossing letters, but the Brooke reference was lost on me. And I couldn’t parse GARGANTUAN… OK, the clue is sound enough, but it’s a bit tortured for my liking. I’m another who prefers the GIZMO spelling, but the instructions in the clue were clear enough not to make this a problem.

    ravenrider @23 – I’m not familiar with RUDBECKIA, my wife is the gardener in our household, but with the help of a few crossing letters, I managed to assemble the letters into the most likely looking word, which turned out to be the correct solution. And the first result on a confirmatory Google search told me that RUDBECKIA is a member of the ASTERACEAE family, which even non-green-fingered me knows is another name for daisies.

    Alphalpha @31 – as an amateur dabbler myself, I wouldn’t necessarily start with the top left corner when filling a grid. If you’re setting a themed puzzle like this, you would probably start by placing the longer themed answers first (I don’t do themed puzzles though). And as you rightly surmise, you do sometimes have to make adjustments and compromises as you go.

  38. [Plants in the Compositae family almost all have daisy-shaped flowers and are often lumped together as “daisies”. Many a gardening article enthuses about “summer and autumn daisies for your borders” while actually recommending plants of many different species.]

    Favourites today MORSEL, HI-MALAYAN and the FANCY Ascot (T)HAT.

  39. More fun today, although nothing too tricky.

    I had no problem with “see below” – the down clues always follow the across clues so they must be below ie in the order you would read them if you ever read them in order.

    Most of this went in quickly and the number theme became clear fairly soon.

    My favourites were GARGANTUAN and HIMALAYAN.

    Thanks to Eileen for reminding us of the wonderful Araucaria clue

    Thanks to Crucible for the wit and inventiveness

  40. Superb crossword and blog.
    I too was a bit puzzled by ‘(see below)’, maybe (qv) would have been slightly less controversial.

  41. Thanks for the blog, not as impressed as most people with this. 21Ac and 15D are pretty dreadful.
    As for ( see below) , I hope it is just a misprint, in the paper 7D is to the right of 16 Ac , in fact slightly above the instruction of ( see below ) .

  42. Found that hard and had to cheat quite a bit to even fill in the grid. Needed the blog to understand several clues, in particular TWENTY-FOUR-SEVEN and TEN TO THREE. I’m always amazed how the bloggers can unravel the mysteries of any clue – I’m simply not literary enough to get there I’m afraid. Many thanks to Crucible and Eileen. And congratulations to Dr Whats On for his low Erdös number. I like to think I have an Erdös number 4, but that’s only because I was a student with someone who now has an E number 3!

  43. Hi Matematico @46, if you’re still there

    the bloggers can unravel the mysteries of any clue – not so!
    Over the years, I’ve constantly maintained that we bloggers (speaking for myself, anyway) are not ‘experts’ but folk who love solving and are prepared to stick their heads above the parapet once a week or so to lead the discussion on the day’s puzzle. As regular readers know, I fairly often have to ask for help on some clue or other – and I really appreciate the speed with which that almost invariably arrives (although it’s often hard to keep up with and acknowledge the flood of responses!).

    I’m glad that most commenters here shared my enjoyment of today’s puzzle – Crucible is one of my long-standing favourite setters and often gifts me some literary gems, like today’s, but, to my shame, I’m often blinded by science. I do believe that, as with the questions in University Challenge, as my Arts graduate friend and I were discussing yesterday, the balance is generally shifting – isn’t it? (I have no idea what you and Dr WhatsOn are talking about!)

  44. I had to cheat for the daisy and GISMO. Not happy about I’S for one’s really. I wrote in LASSO but couldn’t parse it. Then got gamers after checking lasso and revealing gismo.
    I got 24/7 before getting 24 and 7, while I was looking at the Chinese zodiac after googling twelve year cycle, and it made sense. Once I got stitch I saw the connection which helped getting creel later on.

  45. Erd?s number is how far you are away from co-authoring a paper with Paul Erd?s (one of the most prolific writers of maths papers in modern times), like the Bacon number but for maths.

    Obviously all that really matters is the Erd?s-Bacon number though, of which Kevin’s girlfriend Winnie from the Wonder Years (Danica McKellar) has a 6, same as Colin Firth, Stephen Hawking, Richard Feynman, but better than Natalie Portman’s 7.

  46. Looks like wikipedia uses the wrong type of umlaut for pasting into this site, sorry. Erdos with an umlaut over the o.

  47. Enjoyable, general agreement. A late quiblet to add is the awkwardness of 11a: midges do not ‘nip’, they bite.
    Failed on 13a, having missed reading ‘as read’ as homophone indicator. Ta Crucible and Eileen.
    Thinking more broadly about the way in which the English language moves, people are very quick to create rhymes that encapsulate a bit more than the simple words themselves. A ‘nag rag’ is a splendid example.

  48. [ParadigmShifter @50 – it’s actually a Hungarian double acute accent rather than an umlaut (although I gather the Hungarians pronounce it pretty much the same as a German ö).

    With any luck the html code should be &#337 followed by a semicolon; here goes…

    Erdős ]

  49. Hi Chinoz @51

    Having had unpleasant encounters with midges, I hadn’t really thought through the nuances of nip and bite – the effect is the same! 🙁
    I now find, for ‘nip’, in Collins: ‘to give a small sharp bite (to): the dog nipped at his heels‘ and Chambers: ‘to press between two surfaces; to remove or sever by pinching or biting”.
    Nasty, anyway.

  50. Pretty tricky. I had 2 after the first pass of the acrosses, but the downs came to the rescue. I share the reservations about 15. As a standalone clue, it would only be gettable if you happen to be familiar with/guessed the poem.
    Slight quibble with ELL being clued as “some material”. It’s a measure, not a material.
    “length of material” would have been fairer, I think.
    STRETTI was a TILT. Also wasn’t aware that VISCOUNTS are automatically members of the HOL.
    Thanks, Crucible and Eileen.

  51. Nice puzzle and blog. Thanks. Delayed myself with ‘shot’ as the solution for 23d as a double definition with ran away as shot off.

  52. Hi all. Unsurprisingly too tough for me, I got about 60% which I was happy with. I’m still a bit unsure about 15d and how the second half helps the solver, given that literally every time appears twice daily on an analogue wrist watch? Or am I missing something?

  53. I thought it was referring to some kind of poetic meter 10-2-3, then I assumed (since no homophone indicator) that it must be from a poem I didn’t know, but wrote it in anyway since there were a lot of other numbers only clues so it felt right I guess 😉

  54. Stuart et al for 15 down, the second part of the clue tells you that it’s a time. Only two times that I can think of fit the enumeration, ten to three and ten to seven so I found the clue very fair.

  55. Hi Peter. Thanks for replying. I agree ‘ten’ is most likely first word albeit one, two and six are also technically possible (and tough to rule out definitively if you don’t know the poem). As for the hour as well as seven, eight would also fit. I had thought Of Ten to Three as a possible (maybe even probable) answer but I couldn’t see how the second half of the clue helped me narrow my options down.

  56. It turns out that Fan Tuan is the most popular breakfast dish in Shanghai, made of sticky rice…so the “fan” that carries the reversal of a “rag nag” in 6d could be TUAN, instead of an upside-down “nut” surrounding an “a”.

  57. JinA@20: Probably a bit too late to respond to you but just in case…
    TACK, apart from being “stitch”, of course, is also short for “tackle”, as in fishing tackle. (I associate it even more with hearty horsey county types in the “tack room”, where all their riding paraphernalia is kept. It has much more of an English flavour to me than Australian, but I could be wrong – the only truly horsey person I’ve known in Oz certainly used it, but she was in many ways even more English than I am!)

    I admired this puzzle greatly but seem to be going through a phase of late where the brain has to plod through heavy mud rather than trip lightly over the surface. It’s a headspace thing, I think. Thanks to Crucible and to Eileen for yet another excellent blog.

  58. Catflap@40 Now that you mention it, puzzles are the same on my laptop as on yours. Apparently my Platonic puzzle page is the one I knew for years in a newspaper, and my mental image hasn’t caught up with reality.

    PS@50 Erdos’s umlaut isn’t like other countries’. In Hungarian (and only in Hungarian, as far as I know) there are regular umlauts and long ones, which look like two acute accents together. That was Paul Erdos’s umlaut, or whatever the Hungrians call it. I’ll add it here, but it may not survive the software: Erd?s.

    Oops — essexboy @52 is there already. I’ll add that o with a long umlaut is pronounced the same as o with a regular one, but with a longer duration. And the regular on is pronounced the same as an o with an umlaut in German.

    And thanks and admiration once more to Picaroon and Eileen.

  59. When I was young I used to think umlauts were annoying enough now I find out Hungarian has a double version?
    It’s quite annoying in software localisation this (especially games where we tend not to use a spline based font we just render the font at the size we want to a bitmap) – and fonts we do use have missing accents, Polish is a bad one, most fonts have though “Oh I thought you wanted an L but now I’ve crossed it out lol and it sounds a bit like a W instead” e.g. ?ód?, plus accents on characters that aren’t standard in most other European language fonts. Don’t get me started on Asian fonts.

  60. Enjoyed this but only patchy parsing as eg didn’t get to WRIST WATCH until well after TEN TO THREE by which time forgotten.
    Quite quickly done as the theme helped a lot.

    Thanks Eileen and Crucible

  61. MrEssexboy@52 , if you return I know you love this sort of thing. Conferences are very good for getting actual pronunciations from native speakers, Erdos for Hungarians sounds very close to air dish, sorry I cannot be more technical .

  62. [Thanks Roz @67, you know my weakness (or one of them). As Valentine suggests @63, the origin of the ‘double acute’ was to indicate a ‘long umlaut’ – apparently, in centuries past, ő was printed as an o with both an umlaut and an acute accent (indicating length of vowel) on top – which understandably was just too much faff.

    Interesting to hear about your experience at conferences. The main difference between the /ɪ/ in dish and an ‘umlauted’ vowel is the degree of ‘roundedness’ (lip shape). My guess is that because the ő in Erdős is in an unstressed syllable the rounding may be difficult to hear. If you get an opportunity to look next time, it would be interesting to know the exact shape of the speaker’s lips. 😉

    No doubt Eliza (or Professor Higgins) would have been very familiar with all this.

    ParadigmShifter @64/65: I think I’m right in remembering that Petert is our resident Polish expert. He can probably tell us lodz about Łódź ]

  63. The Polish “dark” l is similar to the sound some of us use in words like tackle or coal, so like a w but without any lip pursing.

  64. I’m an old electronic engineer and so not too good on poetry and literature so I parsed ‘Poet’s time’ as ‘P**s off early, tomorrow’s Saturday’. A phrase common at my place of work fifty plus years ago!

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