Guardian 29,011 / Boatman

It’s a few months since I blogged a Boatman puzzle and I enjoyed this challenge – perhaps a little less tricky than he can be.

There is an overt theme of drink, in both clues and answers, with the characteristic references to Boatman – but no Spoonerism this time. I was aware as I wrote the blog that I was using a lot of square brackets, indicating that there were rather a lot of clues involving deletion, which didn’t spoil my enjoyment and I might not have noticed had I not been blogging. There was some ingenious cluing and several smiles along the way. I have one or two niggles, but I might be misreading the clues, so would be glad of suggestions. I learned one or two new things, which is always good.

I had ticks for 9ac DOG KENNEL, 10ac UTTER, 12ac INTENSIVE, 19ac GREASES, 22ac INTESTATE, 27ac PRIMAVERA, 8dn ANGINA, 19dn GAELIC and 21dn PISS-UP.

Thanks to Boatman for an enjoyable puzzle.

Definitions are underlined in the clues.

 

Across

Indulge in drink, losing head (6)
WALLOW
[s]WALLOW (drink)

4 Increases in inflation, as young take on politicians before university (5,2)
PUMPS UP
PUP (young) round MPS (politicians) + U (university) – there seems to be a singular / plural discrepancy here (should be ‘young takes’?)

9 Party? Good! Know direction of line for setter’s home? (3,6)
DOG KENNEL
DO (party) + G (good) + KEN (know) + NE (direction) + L (line) – ‘of’ seems rather awkward

10 Consummate non-consumer consumed by contents of query (5)
UTTER
TT (teetotaller – non-consumer) in [q]UER[y]

11 Alcoholic drink flavoured with fruit and rose, perhaps (5)
SHRUB
Double definition – I didn’t know the first: a mixed drink of lemon or other citrus fruit juice, sugar, spices and a spirit, especially rum

12 Concentrated in core of listeners’ riddle, say (9)
INTENSIVE
IN (from the clue) + [lis]TEN[ers] + SIVE ( ‘sieve’, say = riddle)

13 Falls in Arsenal’s initial profit reversed by the Gunners (7)
NIAGARA
A reversal of  A[rsenal] + GAIN (profit) + RA (Royal Artillery  – Gunners – Arsenal’s nickname)

15 Put an end to drink (6)
SCOTCH
Double definition

17 Troops drop GI, taking odds for leader (3,3)
TOP DOG
Odd letters of TrOoPs DrOp Gi

19 Lubricates drunken serenade, endlessly filling empty glass (7)
GREASES
An anagram (drunken) of SER[en]A[d]E minus ‘end’ in G[las]S

22 Lacking will to use US highway, cutting out middle of journey (9)
INTESTATE
INTE[r]STATE (US highway) minus middle of jou[r]ney

24 Boatman’s last to provide a new start to illuminate the dark (5)
NIGHT
[boatma]N + [l]IGHT (illuminate) with a new initial letter

26 American cold drink initially stirred then drunk (5)
SLUSH
S[tirred] + LUSH (drunk)

27 Vampire beaten by sides of ricotta with fresh vegetables (9)
PRIMAVERA
An anagram (beaten) of VAMPIRE + R[icott]A

28 Quietly removing wrappers from fancy baked food (7)
PANCAKE
P (quietly) + [f]ANC[y] + [b]AKE[d]

29 Contend this would produce a drink when legless (6)
ALLEGE
AL[leg]E, legless, gives ALE (drink)

 

Down

1 A lot of money perhaps leads to embezzlement — special investigator now joins fray (5,2)
WADES IN
WAD (a lot of money, perhaps) + initial letters of Embezzlement Special Investigator Now

2 Drink contents of jug instead of a shot potentially from this (5)
LUGER
L[a]GER (drink) with the ‘a’ replaced by [j]U[G] – a luger is a type of pistol

3 Too much in the drink? (9)
OVERBOARD
Double / cryptic definition, referring to the expression to go overboard, with excessive enthusiasm

4 Boatman’s enemies changing direction in exercise (7)
PILATES
PI[r]ATES (boatman’s enemies) with r (right) changing to L (left)

5 Regret being drunk on rum (5)
MOURN
An anagram (drunk) of ON RUM

6 Regulate misuse of pesticide — it’d cut corners etc (3,6)
SET PIECES
SET (regulate) + an anagram (misuse) of PES[ti]CI[d]E minus it’d – a set piece, in football, is ‘a carefully planned and executed piece of teamwork at a corner or free kick’

7 Trouble initially stopping, cut back and left (6)
PARTED
T[rouble] in PARED (cut back)

8 Article on drink: a cause of pain (6)
ANGINA
AN (article) + GIN (drink) + A

14 Reversal in clue to react? (5,4)
ABOUT TURN
REACT could be clued as RE (about) + ACT (turn)

16 Everyone in this land alone, confused (3,3,3)
ONE AND ALL
An anagram (confused) of LAND ALONE

18 Struggle with drink, its source concealing painful extremes (7)
GRAPPLE
GRAPE (source of drink) round P[ainfu]L

19 Perhaps Irish saga elicits something occult (6)
GAELIC
Hidden (occult – nice) in saGA ELICits

20 Surfeit starts to show at one over eight, say (7)
SATIATE
S[how] + AT + I (one) + (over, in a down clue) ATE (eight, say)

21 Raise drink! Another drink! A lot of drinking (4-2)
PISS-UP
A reversal (raise) of SIP (drink) + SUP (another drink)

23 Sound like a faulty chainsaw, cutting out first in … (5)
SCHWA
An anagram (faulty) of CH[ain]SAW minus ‘a’ (first – I think) and ‘in’
Edit: the definition is ‘sound like a’ – thanks to judygs @21

25 … murder of bargee, not a diver (5)
GREBE
An anagram (murder) of B[a]RGEE

109 comments on “Guardian 29,011 / Boatman”

  1. AlanC

    The theme was obvious from the start but lots of variations made this most enjoyable and it was also not as difficult as usual for this setter. Lots of favourites including WALLOW, TOP DOG, GREASES, NIAGARA, PANCAKE, ALLEGE, PISS UP and the clever ONE AND ALL. Nice use of endless and legless in the respective anagrams. Thanks for parsing SHRUB. Super puzzle.

    Ta Boatman & Eileen.

  2. George Clements

    My first reaction was ‘Oh no, not Boatman’, but it wasn’t too bad. Regarding’Niagara’, I don’t think that there is a problem with the participles, it’s reversal of the A from Arsenal and GAIN together followed by RA for the Gunners (Royal Artillery).

  3. muffin

    Thanks Boatman and Eileen
    New record, I think – question marks against eleven clues. You have resolved most of them, Eileen, but a big one remains; 4d isn’t even ambiguous – “changing direction in exercise” clearly means change the L to R, so the solution is PIRATES.
    I liked INTESTATE and PISS UP.

  4. Petert

    I think NIAGARA is a reversal of A+GAIN followed by RA. I would add INTESTATE to the favourites list. I toyed with CIDER for SHRUB, but remembered it’s Cider With Rosie rather than Rose.

  5. TerriBlislow

    Could not understand (and did not appreciate) the grumpy comments in The Guardian cryptic crossword forum. How very ungracious people are – and how they do not hesitate to publicly spill out their ill-humour. I loved the struggle. Got my proverbial undies in a twist by disregarding “set” for “regulate” in 6d – but finally tumbled to it. My worst mistake was to assume “endlessly” in 19ac meant the usual thing. Genius misdirection – as in so many other clues. Great stuff Boatman. Thanks for the disentangling and the affirmations, Eileen.

  6. Eileen

    Thanks George and Petert- obvious when you say it! I’ll amend the blog.

  7. ravenrider

    There were a couple I couldn’t parse, and I would say 19 should have occults rather than occult but maybe it’s justified by the smoother surface

  8. blaise

    I wondered about “A” for first, but with at least two other football references I justified it by “A team” being the same as “first team”.

  9. paddymelon

    Thank you Eileen for yet another great blog.
    NIAGARA was my favourite because I found humour in overcoming my initial adverse reaction to football (Arsenal) and what I have learned from cryptics, ie military abbreviations, in this case RA. I see the order as expressed by :
    A (Arsenal’s initial) profit = GAIN reversed, by Gunners.

  10. Eileen

    Thanks paddymelon – I’ve amended the blog.

  11. Gazzh

    Thanks Eileen, I had the same thought as you on 4a, didn’t know the shrub class of drink either (makes sense when you think about a mojito and how much greenery is in the glass!), didn’t quite see how 23D worked (think you must be right that A = first, i had been misled by the ellipses into thinking of “M”) and now think more highly of 19d as you have explained the ‘occult’: but was happy with 13A as George Clements@2 describes. I really liked the clever subtractions in 6d and 19a and the poetry/assonance(?) of 21d and 10a, and it’s always good to see a Grebe, thanks Boatman.

  12. paddymelon

    I meant the ”by” to be the indicator of the order, but inadvertently italicised Gunners.
    So many posts in quick succession, but agree with George and Peter T, and Eileen @ 6

  13. AlanC

    I also liked the ‘one over (the) eight’ in SATIATE on the theme of drunkenness.

  14. Flea

    A typical Boatman with food and drink throughout. Re 13a, I just read through as the surface described : Arsenal’s initial A, profit GAIN ( all ) reversed gets to NIAGA ; By juxtapose ; the Gunners RA ( Royal Artillery ) NIAGA + RA. NIAGARA.

    Thank you Boatman and Eileen.

  15. Tim C

    4d is definitely PILATES as I read it.
    Favourite was ABOUT TURN.

  16. Gazzh

    Muffin@3 i don’t think it is quite as clear cut – Wordplay IN Definition is a valid clue construction surely, so that “in” becomes a nicely misleading link word…or is it? But agree that it is ambiguous until 9a is known. (That one did take me a while as a pirate is also a boatman so not necessarily an enemy.)

  17. Lord Jim

    A couple of clever indicators – “murder” for the anagram in 25d, and “occult” for hidden in 19d.

    muffin @3: PILATES was one of my favourites! I think you can read it either way, depending on whether you put the implied comma after “enemies” or after “direction”. The crosser determines the correct answer.

    Many thanks Boatman and Eileen.

  18. Hovis

    Along with others, I think that 4d is a little sloppy. With this type of clue, solvers shouldn’t have to wait for a crosser to determine the correct answer. I also agree that PIRATES is the more obvious solution. Apart from this gripe, the usual excellent crossword I expect from this setter.

  19. michelle

    Liked ALLEGE.

    I did not parse 19ac, 14d.
    6d why does set pieces = corners etc? Oh I see – I am football ignorant!

    19ac clue seemed to be overly wordy.

    I agree with Eileen that 4ac would be better as ‘young takes’.
    I am fine with 13ac = rev of A GAIN and finally add (by the) RA.

    New for me: SHRUB = a drink made of sweetened fruit juice and spirits, typically rum or brandy; SLUSH = cold drink (eww, sounds like a horrible beverage!)

    Thanks, both.

  20. muffin

    Gazzh @16
    As you may remember, I frequently complain about the “wordplay in definition” construction. It doesn’t work for me.

  21. Shanne

    I really liked the clarity of the cluing here, although I took almost as long again resolving the northeast corner, as I did on the rest of the problem, although it’s difficult to see why in retrospect. I vaguely knew SHRUB from Jane Austen, so just double checked it was the drink I thought was.

    Thank you to Eileen and Boatman.

  22. judygs

    Many thanks to Boatman for the fun puzzle, and to Eileen for the blog. I didn’t ponder much on PILATES because I’d already entered 9a – but wouldn’t the 4d ambiguity be removed if the clue ended ‘… *for* exercise.’? I suspect the intended definition in 23d is ‘Sound like a’ – the indefinite article is (usually) pronounced as schwa – /?/. (Hope phoneme will travel!)

  23. manhattan

    PISS UP!! Come on you’re better than this!!

  24. Gervase

    Enjoyable puzzle with imaginative use of the toping theme.

    I liked NIAGARA (which parses well, as previous posters have noted), UTTER, SATIATE and PISS UP, and the use of ‘occult’ as a container indicator and ‘endless’ in an unusual way. Always good to see a SCHWA. SHRUB is one of those almost forgotten drinks, like ‘bishop’, which are useful for setters.

    Like Eileen I plumped for PILATES, but muffin @3 gives a valid alternative; however, the clue can be read either way.

    PRIMAVERA was a hopeful cue that spring may be just around the corner – pity about the surface. I thought the drink was a ‘slushy’, but SLUSH seems to be a valid alternative.

    Thanks to Boatman and Eileen

  25. Flea

    As regards 4d, I tend to think about placing a “clarifying comma”, in my mind’s eye, not originally there.

    Boatman’s enemies, changing direction in exercise would lead to PIRATES

    Boatman’s enemies changing direction, in exercise. would lead to PILATES

    It’s awkward when there are no crossers in the vital place, but there is one this morning.

    My fave was 10a UTTER.

  26. Shanne

    michelle @19, in the UK we have/had machines serving luridly coloured drinks called SLUSH puppies, although they may have fallen foul of recent legislation to limit sugar in drinks.

  27. Eileen

    judygs @21 – thank you: you’re obviously right about the clever definition in 23dn. I’ll amend the blog now.

  28. Gervase

    Flea’s disambiguating comma would serve to clarify PILATES; judygs’s suggestion of ‘for’ is even more definitive.

  29. KVa

    OVERBOARD:
    ‘Too much’ is one definition as pointed out in the blog by Eileen.
    ‘in the drink?’ is the other definition (cryptic).
    As ‘the drink’ means ‘the sea’ and ‘overboard’ also means ‘over the side of a ship
    or boat into the water,’ ‘in the drink?’ is the cryptic definition.

    Has Eileen meant the same while calling this a double/cryptic definition?

  30. Eileen

    KVa @29 – yes!

  31. paddymelon

    manhattan@23. I thought PISS-UP was very clever and funny. (Not that I condone this practice.) Manhattan of course is a cocktail, but couldn’t find an anagram, or partial, or rebus, to make my case.

  32. Widdersbel

    Thanks, Boatman and Eileen. Complete opposite of George Clements @2 – my first thought on opening the puzzle today was “Hurrah! Boatman!” – I always find there’s a lot of fun to be had in a Boatman puzzle and this one was up to the usual standard. My favourites were ALLEGE and GREASES for the inventive construction of the clues, NIAGARA for the surface, INTESTATE for its deceptive simplicity, and GAELIC for the clever use of “occult” – always impressive when a setter manages to make a hidden word clue anything other than blindingly obvious.

    It didn’t occur to me that there was any ambiguity in 4d because I already had the L in place by the time I got to it.

    michelle @19 – coincidentally, “corners etc” was used to define the same solution in another puzzle elsewhere very recently so it didn’t take too long for the penny to drop on that one for me.

  33. AlanC

    manhattan @23: and your objection I what exactly? Funny clue as pm states and a very common expression.

  34. paddymelon

    Above and beyond with KVa and Eileen re OVERBOARD.

  35. Pino

    [Gervase
    You asked @39 yesterday if anyone had access to the OED. It may be useful to you or other readers to know that it is available free online to subscribers to most public libraries in the UK and that some overseas academic institutions also subscribe. You have to look up individual words. You can’t download the whole thing.]

  36. beaulieu

    Favourites include NIAGARA, GREASES, SET PIECES. A couple of quibbles which have already been mentioned. But I don’t understand complaints that PILATES is ambiguous without the crossing L from KENNEL – it’s a crossword, so one uses crossers as well as information from the clue and enumeration, to get the answer. Otherwise there might as well just be a list of clues, each to be solved in isolation.
    Thanks Eileen and Boatman.

  37. Robi

    Enjoyable and quite straightforward for a Boatman, I thought.

    Gazzh @16; there is endless discussion about the use of ‘in’ as a linker. It’s convenient to use it either way around but I know of at least one editor who would say that it should only be definition in wordplay.

    I liked PANCAKE for the removal of wrappers and SET PIECES because of ‘cut corners’.

    Thanks Boatman and Eileen (TILT was SHRUB as a drink).

  38. poc

    I think i’ve only heard the drink called a ‘slushy’, and Chambers seems to agree.

    I agree with Eileen’s comment on 4a. The cryptic grammar doesn’t work.

    Can anyone explain the ellipses in 23d and 25d?

  39. Geoff Down Under

    There were quite a few irritations, but a quick scroll through the above would indicate that most have been covered. For example, 4d is ambiguous and could be either PILATES or PIRATES. Mourn and regret are pretty approximate synonyms I’d have thought. I didn’t know that RA are the gunners, and never heard of this meaning of set pieces. In the clue for 4a, take should surely be takes. I was unaware that a shrub is a drink. I was unaware till I looked it up that “surfeit” could be a verb. A few others too, but I’ve ranted enough. After breezing through Carpathian’s yesterday, I guess I was unprepared to return to a puzzle full of head scratchers.

  40. Boatman

    Thank you, Eileen and all – glad you had fun today.
    With hindsight, I agree that “young take” isn’t quite right in 4 Ac. Of course, “takes” wouldn’t quite work with the surface reading, but something like “… with young taking on …” would have been better.
    Judygs@21 – I was waiting to see how long it would take for someone to work out what had happened to the definition in 23 Dn, and you’ve got it exactly right – kudos to you!

  41. Gervase

    [Pino @35: Thanks for that. Downloading the whole shebang would be too much for my poor smartphone anyway! 🙂 ]

  42. judygs

    Oh, thank you, Boatman!

  43. Julie in Australia

    Thanks to Boatman for an enjoyable puzzle (I thought all the references to drinks and drinking in both clues and solutions were clever) and to Eileen for her usual thorough and interesting blog, which, along with some of the posts, helped to explain some things I didn’t quite understand. I’m in the “slushy/slushie” camp as regards 26a. All my favourites have already been canvassed above.

  44. copmus

    Good. Occasionally moderate.

  45. William

    Thank you, Eileen, needed your excellent parsing of several.

    I intended to come here and question the part of speech in SATIATE, but a glance in Chambers showed surfeit as a verb as well as a noun.

    Ticks ask over the place but admired ABOUT TURN particularly.

    Many thanks, both.

  46. copmus

    I am missing themes lately
    Which somehow reminds me of a Bunthorne clue which read

    EL (3 ,6, 10)
    Only he could get away with that.

  47. mrpenney

    I don’t see a problem with “wordplay in definition.” Think of it like a cocktail recipe: there’s gin and dry vermouth in a martini. There’s also a mart, me, and Northern Ireland in a martini.

  48. mrpenney

    Also on the slush / slushy thing: most of the names out there are proprietary to the companies that make the machines that produce them; I think slush is a generic alternative, mut most people here call them slushies. If you’re not familiar, it’s ice that’s crushed to the point of being slush, churned together with flavored syrup. Some bars also serve alcoholic slushies, adding vodka to the mix (and usually using more adult flavors). With that exception, I think most people grow out of them by the time they’re ten or so. Too sweet!

  49. Ark Lark

    Very enjoyable, good use of the theme and on the gentler side for us solvers.

    I didn’t have any quibbles. I even recognised SLUSH from Slush Puppies!

    Favourite was SET PIECES

    Thanks Boatman and Eileen

  50. Amoeba

    Well that was fun, and I’m with those who found this on the gentler side for Boatman. MOURN and PISS-UP were my favourites.

    Thanks Eileen for clearing up a couple of parsings, and thanks Boatman.

  51. Flea

    What’s occurring copmus@46 ? Let them eat (pan) CAKE in The French Revolution ?

  52. Wellbeck

    Worth it for PILATES alone – which made me grin & has given me a mental picture of The Pilates Of The Caribbean: all of them working on their core muscles…
    UTTER, PANCAKE and PISS UP were also very satisfying.
    In short, a delight – as is always the case with a Boatman oeuvre. Many thanks to him and to Eileen for the blog and the parsing of SHRUB, which defeated me and was a CFE (crossed fingers entry).

  53. Ronald

    NIAGARA falls in first of all, then lots to enjoy thereafter, though ridiculously had All And One in at 16d instead of ONE AND ALL, and couldn’t quite understand why things became difficult in that area of the puzzle. Wasn’t able to parse PUMPS UP, SHRUB, or PILATES, so thanks to Eileen yet again. Last one is was perhaps appropriately enough the summary to an entertaining solve, PISS UP…

  54. Boatman

    Flea @51 – I’m glad you said that, otherwise I’d have spent far too long thinking about Cop’s contribution @46!

  55. Gervase

    [copmus @46: The wordplay is exemplary but the clue lacks a definition. Very naughty but nice 🙂 ]

  56. Gervase

    [….of course Araucaria used to do the same sort of thing with clues like HIJKLMNO (5)]

  57. Dr. WhatsOn

    It seems there are two camps regarding whether a clue should be entirely disambiguated on its own or needs the help of crossers – unusually for me, I can’t decide which is preferable. However there are some of the form
    term operation term
    where you can’t decide if the operation associates to the left or right and the offending letter is not crossed so you don’t know. I thought at first that LUGER (LAGER) was one of these, but the operation in this case reads so much better in one direction, as well as there being the ‘this’.

    I liked the theme, but wondered whether 18d GRAPPLE (using grape) was a missed opportunity for adding in grappa as a misdirection somehow.

    Thanks B&E

  58. Flea

    Boatman’s been samping the temperature of the WATER twice, in this 15^2 blog, this morning. I want to thank him for such an overboard contribution. It’s appreciated ! He does definitions, Araucaria not.

  59. Boatman

    Hah! You’re welcome, Flea @58 – Yes, I do like to see a definition. Clues like the H2O one are, well, they’re something, and a clever and amusing thing if done well. I just can’t bring myself to see them as cryptic clues, exactly – but that’s only because I particularly value the feeling that a conventional clue gives you of your brain making a connection between two problems (definition & wordplay) simultaneously. If you take a broader view and say that a cryptic clue is any fiendish device that leads you unambiguously to a solution, then the H2O type of clue is absolutely fine – and you could say the same thing about CD clues, where there’s a definition but no wordplay. In practice, I’m much more tolerant of CD clues – I very rarely set them myself, but that’s only because I don’t like them unless they’re really, really good. How Rufus managed to produce them so regularly and to such a high standard is a mystery.

  60. Valentine

    I have to leave and don’t have time to read all the comments, so I apologize if I raise a point that somebody else already has.

    I had a terrible time with this puzzle for reason’s not Boatman’s or the editor’s fault. There was a huge advertisement for Mailchimp splat across the upper part of the puzzle and clues. Now and then it would disappear for a few seconds and then reappear. so I seized what moments I could, but I ended up revealing a few. This would happen at a time when my printer is also on the fritz, so I couldn’t work from a printed copy.

    11ac SHRUB is something I associate with Victorian novels.

    The meaning of SET PIECES is a new one on me.

    Bye for now. Thanks, Boatman and Eileen.

  61. Charles

    Much quicker solve than usual for Boatman. Didn’t know shrub was a drink but couldn’t be anything else.

  62. Simon S

    Valentinr @ 60 (if you see this later)

    There was a similar issue recently with an advert for jet2

    Someone emailed the help link on the graun crossword home page, and the advert was blocked from appearing on crossword pages.

    That might work in this case too.

  63. Laccaria

    Very entertaining and yes perhaps one of the less arcane Boatmans. LOI was SCHWA – I knew the word (how many didn’t?) but I’m a bit doubtful about ‘first’ for A. Was it not Boatman (my mentor, as he is of many other would-be setters!) who taught us, “all the letters of the fodder have to be in the clue”? Does that perhaps extend to “all the letters to be removed from the fodder must also be in the clue”? I ask because there’s no ‘a’ in the wordplay.

    Oh well – I think I’m entitled to have a little pop at Boatman, am I not?

    I suppose one has to laugh at PISS-UP! How many of the Grauniad‘s rivals would disallow that? I wouldn’t dare such a thing with Mike H at the Indy!

    And this reminds me of a little anecdote. Many moons ago, a colleague of mine wanted to throw a well-lubricated get-together in the local brewery (Harveys of Lewes) for his birthday. But when he applied to them, he was told that (a) there was over a year’s waiting list, and (b) they wouldn’t tolerate drunkenness on their premises. So he dropped the plan.

    So it’s quite true: my colleague couldn’t organise … 🙂

    Many thanks to Boatman and Eileen. Worthwhile entertainment!

  64. Laccaria

    Another thought re 4a: perhaps “youngster takes” would work better for the surface, since ‘young’ is more of a collective noun.

  65. tim the toffee

    SHRUB was new meaning to me and PRIMAVERA only seen with Botticelli. SCHWA is one of those “only seen in crosswords” and not yet sunk in. Otherwise there were a lot of easy clues but I’m not complaining.
    Thanks Boatman and Eileen

  66. Paul

    Thought that this was going to be tough but was smooth and steady in the end. INTESTATE, PANCAKE and DOG KENNEL were my favourites. INTENSIVE my LOI and unparsed – thanks for the explanation Eileen and the excellent blog. Thanks Boatman for the fun.

  67. monkeypuzzler

    Anyone else bothered/misled by the reference in 20d of “startS to” that then leads to taking the start to only one word? If it had been “starts to Show At The one over eight say” it would be more logical, but perhaps at a cost of a lesser quality surface.
    I really enjoyed this one though. Many thanks to Boatman & Eileen.

  68. gladys

    Hard work. I had to wait for DOG KENNEL to be sure which way round PILATES went. Knew SHRUB was an old fashioned drink, but not what was in it, so the reference to fruit was no help. Failed to parse ABOUT TURN, and PUMPS UP didn’t quite work either. Favourites UTTER and PISS UP.

  69. Haggis

    Reminds me of a teenage holiday in the West Country 40-odd years ago where I learned of two drinks: rum and shrub, and brandy and lovage. Thanks Boatman and Eileen

  70. phitonelly

    monkeypuzzler @67
    Yes, I was. I like your edit – makes the surface even better.
    Great puzzle, Boatman. Very inventive cluing.
    Thanks, Eileen and himself.

  71. Katherine

    Thanks Boatman and Eileen.
    I didn’t have a problem with ‘young take on …’. I read it in the sense of ‘an animal and its young’ – this could mean on several babies who could, collectively, take on the MPs if they felt so inclined. Does this work?

  72. Tony Santucci

    Thanks Boatman for an excellent crossword full of wit. My top picks were WALLOW, UTTER, PANCAKE, ANGINA, GRAPPLE, and PISS UP. I have no problem with ambiguity like PILATES/pirates where a crossing letter clarifies the solution — it’s part of the puzzle in my view. Thanks Eileen for helping me parse SHRUB, SET PIECES, and ABOUT TURN. And like Boatman I prefer crosswords with as few CD’s as possible — the main reason I switched from American to British puzzles was for the challenge of the wordplay.

  73. loren ipsum

    Thanks Boatman and Eileen!

    A fun solve for me, with a few I needed Eileen’s guidance to parse 🙂

    My two cents as a US solver/drinker: I’m not sure I’ve ever said “drinking a slush,” but I knew what was meant and it didn’t bother me (although I’d more likely eat slush with a spoon, probably on a beach boardwalk). Slushee is indeed a brand name and the first word that comes to mind to refer to the beverage. The alcoholic versions come in any flavor/booze combo you can imagine, most commonly in tourist destinations that appeal to college binge drinkers. (In New Orleans they’re called daiquiris). A pink wine based version has become common in some NY bars, called of course “frosé”.
    Shrub as a drink was familiar to me because it’s having a bit of a moment in hipsterish US bars as a cocktail ingredient.

  74. jvector

    DrW @ 57, I thought the same about 18d! Thoroughly enjopyed this; not sure what the grumpies on the Guardian site were on.

  75. muffin

    Tony Santucci @72 (and others)
    My point about 4d (@3) is that it isn’t ambiguous – the clue clearly gives PIRATES.

  76. Gervase

    muffin @75: But hysteron proteron is a common trick in Cruciverbia

  77. Alphalpha

    I hear you muffin@ and while the clue gave me no trouble (I got DOG KENNEL first) I subscribe to the view that a clue should be soluble in it’s own right without crossers; but that’s not your point. Perhaps if it had been ”Boatman’s enemies changing direction for exercise’ all gods might have been served?

    Gervase@: a new one on me – I’ll look it up.

  78. AndrewTyndall

    [Valentine @60: I have found that the obscuring ads appear when browsing with Firefox but not with Safari. Which were you using?]

  79. Tony Santucci

    Muffin @75: Your parsing and Eileen’s parsing of 4d are equally valid, hence the ambiguity.

  80. Ane Miren

    Now that PRIMAVERA is almost here, I hope to see the Great Crested GREBEs doing their mating tango again, with weeds in their beaks instead of roses, on Woodberry Wetlands reservoir. And then to see the cute chicks, like little zebras, after nature works its magic.
    And today is the feast day of SS Perpetua y Felicidad so let us combine the two as happiness for ever. Viva happiness!

  81. Bleudot

    SHRUB here in the land of trendy food (Los Angeles) means a fruit-infused vinegar. Surprisingly, they are delicious with champagne. Think of a less sweet mimosa. Speaking of sweet, I’ve never heard of a SLUSH but Slushies/Icees/Slurpees are excellent drinks if you are looking to achieve diabetic status by the age of 21.

    I quite enjoyed this puzzle although I left a lot of clues unsolved in the southwest corner. PISS-UP was new to me, as well as SET PIECES, and I still don’t see how ACT = TURN.

  82. Simon S

    Bleudot @ 81

    It’s a theatrical reference, possibly dating back to music hall or variety performances.

    An act or turn would have their set amount of time on stage.

  83. Eileen

    You just beat me to it, Simon – thanks. 😉

  84. Tony Santucci

    Bleudot@81: One good turn deserves another.

  85. Huntsman

    Top notch puzzle & very entertaining. Very interested in reading comments on PIL(R)ATES. I had it wrong initially until the checker put me right & sort of mentally tossed a coin for LU(A)GER also but now see there’s no ambiguity with that one. SCHWA is one word I won’t forget.
    Thanks both

  86. SanDiegoBrit

    Shrubb (2 Bs) is a Caribbean rum cocktail, based on orange zest if I remember rightly. A couple of those and I don’t remember anything!

  87. the last plantagenet

    A truly awful puzzle with a litany of mistakes. I almost liked 21, apart from its Guardian-rudeness, but I suppose we shall have to continue to put up with that too, ad infinitum.

  88. AlanC

    Tumbleweed

  89. William F P

    Great blog
    Delightful puzzle
    (But too easy; Boatman is one I often set aside, like Enigmatist, for a Saturday morning coffee tussle – glad I didnt!)
    Many thanks, both and all

  90. PostMark

    Many thanks to tpg @87: not so much for the contents of the nasty little note but for thoughtfully leaving the post so late in the day, meaning most of us didn’t have to see it.

  91. GregfromOz

    In parsing SCHWA, I took it as a “faulty CHAINSAW, minus “IN” and “A”, the latter being the “first” letter.

    I don’t think I agree with the “Sound like A” parsing, because that leaves an “A” unaccounted for in the fodder.

  92. Abc_Bot

    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/slush
    SLUSH
    1 a: partly melted or watery snow
    b: loose ice crystals formed during the early stages of freezing of salt water
    c: SLUSHY
    “Cut watermelon into small chunks and freeze, then blend frozen fruit and buttermilk to make a cooling fruit SLUSH.”—Sunset Magazine…

  93. lady gewgaw

    Not my cup of slush, I’ll admit, but I did like the SCHWA clue, or at least, uh, its definition part.

  94. Cellomaniac

    I was surprised that there continued to be complaints about the 4a PILATES after beaulieu@36 so perfectly explained why ambiguity that is resolved by crossers is not a flaw in a crossword clue.

    I had more difficulty deciding whether “drink” or “this” was the definition in 2d LUGER, because the crossers didn’t help, and the logic of the solution was too much for my tiny brain.

    I see from my printout that I had ticks beside 10 clues, so this was an especially enjoyable puzzle to solve. My favourite of the ten was 19a GREASES, for the endlessly misleading subtraction and the apt surface. Thanks Boatman for the fun and Eileen for the oxymoronic typically exceptional blog.

  95. judygs

    GregfromOz@91: see Boatman@40

  96. pdp11

    A late finish for me but this was very nicely done, Boatman. Thanks Eileen for the great blog, as usual.

    tlp@87 thank you for your continued entertaining contributions. I take it you don’t read the Guardian. If you did, you’d see a lot “worse”.

    But what I really wanted to say, and not because it’s a cute pun, is that for me, PISS UP was the pièce de résistance in a fine puzzle 🙂

  97. paul b

    ‘Ambiguity that is resolved by crossers is not a flaw in a crossword clue’.

    Depends which club you’re a member of, old boy.

  98. Cellomaniac

    Good point, Paul b@97. I belong to a club whose members don’t like making up completely unnecessary rules and then criticizing setters who don’t follow them. I think it’s a small club.

  99. Roz

    It is a matter of democracy, every clue has the right to be cold-solved all by itself.

  100. Cellomaniac

    …in which case you can dispense with grids, delete the word ‘cross’, and just call them cryptic word puzzles. (:

  101. Lewis

    Wikipedia has a very nice piece on the history of the shrub. When the weather is a bit warmer, I’ll concoct a shrub slush.

    Very nice puzzle. Even a rank amateur could grind out much satisfaction.

  102. WhiteDevil

    Didn’t parse a good half dozen, but still struggled to the end. Chapeau, Boatman!

  103. paul b

    Cello, it’s about fairness, isn’t it. Fairness means giving the solver the best chance. The setter loses gracefully, as the saying goes. And if the solver’s first ‘solved’ clue is an ambiguity, then the setter has been obstructive, not enabling the solver to proceed. End of story. You’re absolutely wrong.

  104. Roz

    Cellomaniac@100 I do use the grid but only after I have look at each across in turn and put them in , I then look at each down in turn without looking at the grid, I put them in when I have tried all the downs. Each clue has a fair chance of being cold-solved, I then do each corner. A careful setter will make sure that each clue can be solved by itself.

  105. cellomaniac

    paul b, if I’m solving a clue, and one letter could be either A or B depending on the crosser, I pencil in A/B. That narrows it down to 2 out of 26 possible letters, to help solve the crossing clue. How is that unfair? Also, is it not the setter’s job to be obstructive (within reason)?

    Roz, I understand that you (and paul b and others) think every clue must be cold-solvable (cold soluble?) by itself. What I don’t understand is why?

  106. Roz

    If they are not then it means that some answers are more important than others , they get put in to decide letters for the weaker clues. It leads to “All clues are equal , but some are more equal than others ” .

  107. cellomaniac

    But all clues are not equal, Napoleon notwithstanding – some are more difficult than others, some are funnier or more clever than others, some require more specialized knowledge than others, etc. If all clues were equal, and none were more equal than others, then would Rufus’ and Enigmatist’s clues be neither more nor less equal than each other? And is it wrong of some setters to scatter a few easier clues around the grid to give solvers a way into their puzzles? (Or to occasionally have unusual words as solutions, to give our Chambers ’93 a workout?)

    Actually, in my experience at least, with most of the “offending” clues it is relatively easy to narrow down the solution to the two possibilities with one A/B letter. That’s why I don’t see them as being unfair (as long as the A/B letter crosses with another clue) – they don’t really hold up the solver and make the puzzle unduly difficult.

  108. Roz

    My final word on this , equal in this context does not mean the same , it means having equal rights and status. Every clue once solved , deserves to have the answer put in the grid without requiring other answers to help.

  109. Cellomaniac

    …and my final word on this is that, Roz, you are one of my favourite commenters on this site, because your contributions are always engaging, even (or especially) when I disagree with them. If I don’t have time to read all the comments, I scroll through to find yours.

Comments are closed.