Financial Times 17,890 by Zamorca

15 comments on “Financial Times 17,890 by Zamorca”

1. I accidentally threw my paper with its notes out, and the only thing I remember about the puzzle was not knowing why Ford = Ka in 5d and thinking about 1dn that “all down clues are vertical”.

   Thanks for the blog, Pete. And thanks for the puzzle Zamorca. Sorry I could not comment more.

2. I really enjoyed this.

   Favourites were: FORTHWITH, JOKE, AWRY, SHINER, GAFFER

   Thanks Zamorca and Pete Maclean

3. I’ve seen ‘vertical’ used for a reversal in a down clue before but, as I also have pointed out before, it doesn’t work. Vertical refers equally to ‘up’ as it does ‘down’ in my opinion. Also, I have complained about clues like 24a. Although grammar such as commas are often for the surface, not for the cryptic reading, very few setters would write clues where you have to ignore a hyphen. Wine-drinking is the opposite of ‘wine drinking’. These two clues spoiled an otherwise good crossword.

4. I thought 24a was fine: a nice bit of misdirection, if perhaps not the most difficult clue.

5. I enjoyed this puzzle, which I finished over a couple of sessions but with one or two queries in terms of parsing. I’m surprised how often I don’t spot a very simple hidden word – ALONE was one of those times. Thanks very much, Pete, for the blog, and thanks Zamorca.

6. Andrew B. That’s fine. I just make the point that ‘wine-drinking people’ doesn’t refer to a wine that drinks people, so you have to ignore the hyphen. Is this different from ignoring other types of punctuation, or so-called ‘playtex’ clues? In my opinion, yes but, of course, others are free to disagree. Who knows, maybe I’ll change my mind if other setters start to do this.

7. This puzzle is, (I think), my first Zamorca, but I hope not the last.
   It was like a mug of creamy tomato soup on a winter evening…smooth and satisfying.
   After cracking 3 (down) as my first, the appearance of the trusty A-Z (literally) suggested a pangram. Not usually my cup of tea; but this was soup, of course.

   I appreciate elegant surface readings, which Zamorca provided aplenty. 22(ac) is lovely.

   Flies in my soup? Only a few midges, nothing to call the waiter over for.
   9(ac) VISTA ; not sure about the final A. Is the word “first” doing double-duty?
   11(ac) battle=war;
   6 (down) “no good” = ng

   I know they are not “wrong”, just not to my taste.

   At 26(ac), the Buffalo jarred with me: I’d have gone “Gigalo never content without a partner”, and risked being lambasted by the spelling police!

   Petty quibbles all, and they did not detract from a delicious serving. Seconds please, Zamorca.

   Ta, too, to Mr. Maclean

8. Thanks Zamorca and Pete

   9ac: A for “Academician” is given on its own in Chambers 2016 p 1, so “first” is not doing double duty
   11ac: battle=war is probably smoother as verbs than as nouns
   6dn ng for “no good” is in Chambers p 1037.

9. PB@8, many thanks, I appreciate your post, and I stand duly corrected.

   Now, PB, I don’t have Chambers, so can you tell me, why “with” equates to “w”? (ex Chambers?).

   It always defeats me, and yet it’s so often used.
   These single letter abbreviations are the bane of my novice solving.
   After I posted, I did (as you say) re-think that “to war” might be converted as “to battle”, so verbs. Good spot, point well made, and agreed.

   I will never be convinced that “no good” = NG.
   I may have to give up on this game!

   cheers, Ian B

10. ENB@9: thanks for getting back to me. For what it is worth, w for “with” is indeed in Chambers, and also Collins 2023, ODE 2010, and SOED 2007, these all being the most recent editions. I found ng for “no good” in Collins as well, but not in ODE: SOED has it as n.g.

    If setters continue to use a device that you really dislike, and editors continue to allow it, you may have to make a choice and decide that there is still enough to enjoy in the rest of each crossword. I have come to that position with the unsignalled requirement to split a clue word (for example, “fish indeed” = COD in DEED = DECODED). A lot of people like clues that use that device, but when necessarily I will remind the world that it does not have universal approval.

    Note: ODE 2010 is the single volume Oxford Dictionary of English, third edition of the dictionary launched as the New Oxford Dictionary of English in 1998. SOED 2007 is the sixth edition of the two volume Shorter Oxford English Dictionary.

11. ENB @ 9 To expand on PB’s comment @ 10 re w = with and give an example of usage, back in the days of vinyl singles releases used to be listed as A-side c/w (coupled with) or b/w (backed with B-side.

12. PB@10, thanks again, and, wow!
    We are in the same game, same area, but different leagues, I fear.

    (Tranmere Rovers v Liverpool)

    “with” & “no good” are now going into my OK list.

    Thank you for all the background & info., much appreciated.
    Ian B

13. Simon@11, and Pelham B

    Many (many) years ago, there was a racehorse called “W Five Times”.
    He was a slow starter, but always finished fast.
    He had to be held back, and produced his winning run in the last 50 yards.
    The trainer revealed, the name was to tell the jockey, “Will Win When Waited With”.

    So, With=W, is fine by me.

    Simon’s vinyl reference makes sense to me, too.

    Thank you, chaps, for the feedback.

14. Hovis@3, vertical is a (somewhat slangy) synonym for “standing up”, and in that sense it works as a reversal indicator in a down clue.

15. I remember seeing a French movie titled “Staying Vertical” where ‘vertical’ had this sense of standing up. But I remain unconvinced about ‘vertical’ serving as a reversal indicator.

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