Guardian 29,778 – Yank

77 comments on “Guardian 29,778 – Yank”

1. In 21A, it is a fifth of ‘mullED wine’, otherwise we lack a D. Thanks Yank and Andrew

2. I’m still a hopeful student,hope to learn from everyone.Thank you for the explanations,Andrew.

3. Thanks Yank, and also Andrew for a few parsings here. I got LATTES as the only anagram of ‘latest’ that would fit, but really…? Thought THREE-POINTERS was very good once the penny dropped (presumably you get 3 points for a long shot [basket] in B-Ball). Enjoyed ANTIGONE and ASBESTOS. NEGLIGENT looks as if it was originally written for a down clue.

4. I saw a “fifth of mullED wine” as Russthree@1, though I felt it was loose given that there are many two letter combinations to consider before arriving at the correct one. Failed with the definition of THREE-POINTERS and “first-string” is new to me and not in Chambers, perhaps it’s elsewhere.
   All in all good fun though.
   Thanks to Y and A.

5. And not sure “isn’t half” is the same as saying “half of isn’t” per the blog.

6. I was writing notes before the blog (below). I thought this was really satisfying. It took over an hour but every solution was entered confidently.

   Is THREE POINTERS the most fitting answer to a triple definition? (You get 3 points for a basket scored from range, Steph Curry being a fine current exponent.) I see the scat is back. (I offer Long read during messy crap and a wee (3,5,5) in response.)

   I thought this was looking bleak after the first pass and was delighted to complete it with dictionary checks for RAGA and NATES and a web search for ROVER. If it were a former husband would we expect an H? I have no complaints with EXTRACTION, or any clue , but did waste time seeking something specifically wifey.

   I liked a lot of the clues FORGET IT, SUPERBOWLS, ICE SCULPTURES and NAKED EYE spring to mind but there were so many good ones.

   Thanks Yank and Andrew

7. Couldn’t for the life of me get WEED, but chuckled when I read the explanation here. There were a few others I couldn’t parse, and I thought that requiring decades-old knowledge of Guardian compilers was a bit mean. The “raised” in 23d is a reversal indicator, which would be fine if it referred to the answer, but is it legit referring to the clue?

   I couldn’t account for a stray D in 21a until I thought of a fifth as a fraction (as Russthree@1). All a bit messy, as Jay@4 intimated.

8. Enjoyable, though I didn’t parse quite a few (and had to look up some) – thanks a lot Yank, and Andrew for the explanations! Liked SUPER BOWLS, FINK, FORGET IT, ICE SCULPTURES, WEED. Couldn’t relate “long baskets” to basketball, and did’t know RAGA or Scott Joplin (couldn’t make sense of it thinking it related to Janis)

9. As a Yankee myself I found the puzzle relatively straightforward but lots of fun. I had never heard of the setter Rover, but I assumed it was that when I was going through. My favorites were THREE POINTERS, ANTIGONE and FINK ( don’t recall seeing Fink in a puzzle in a while), but it made me think of RAT FINK, of 1960s cartoon fame. Thanks Yank and thank you to Andrew for a great blog.
   I see I have a brother from another mother ahead of me —Hi Jay!

10. Martin @6 – good point about EX; I guess we wouldn’t have looked for an H if it said “former husband” would we? 🙂

11. Thanks Yank and Andrew
    I didn’t enjoy this. Too many very loose definitions and Byzantine parsings.
    Alternate for substitute I’ve only heard when (very occasionally) watching American sports – it isn’t a British usage.
    I did like the SUPERB OWLS.

12. [ Yes Jay@9, it seems there are now three Jays… me in the UK, you in the US and JAY in all caps, location unknown. Hopefully there’s no confusion! ]

13. No worries @12,I’ll post myself as JAY L(L for learner)to allay any confusion in future.

14. All good, Jay. Hopefully, I’ll get credit for saying some smart things I never would have thought of on my own.

15. Thanks Andrew. Yes, CONTINGENT reminded me of Picaroon yesterday. I started off with a container of CAN (is able) until the penny dropped. Not the usual “it” of British crosswords, and the “internal force” was masterful.

    I liked the eccentric Yankee in NAKED EYE, and the anagrind “screwing around” in EDISON (the Edison screw bulb).

    My first thought for “Joplin” was Janis, but fortunately I soon remembered Scott and Ravi Shankar’s RAGAs.

    ICE SCULPTURES was inspired.

16. A few unparsed here also, but I found this a very satisfying solve: one of those I found tricky but not impenetrable. Plus – and perhaps the main thing – I enjoyed it all along the way.

17. The boot on the other side of The Pond a bit today, with several American references as Andrew has mentioned. So didn’t find this an easy solve. Held up by THREE POINTERS, CONCERT GRAND, and ALTERNATES whose meanings I wasn’t familiar with. Also LATTES. Liked FORGET IT and NEGLIGENT. Rather a mixed bag experience for me…

18. A bit of a step up from the start of the week with a lot not fully parsed so I made great use of the blog today.

    Enjoyed the SUPERB OWLS

    Thanks Yank and Andrew

19. Jay @4 (the 4 distinguishes it from the seemingly multiplying Jays 🙂 ), “first-string” is in the Canadian Oxford Dictionary, the NOAD, the ODE, the shorter OED and Collins, but as you say not in Chambers.

20. Solving this, like doing the NYT mini puzzle, reminds me both how much our languages have diverged and how little I know of popular culture. Yank’s surfaces have improved and there are many excellent clues here. For the surface of the rather convoluted binge-drinker it’s worth noting that in the USA “a fifth” is a standard sized bottle for strong spirits (a fifth of a gallon, equal to one of our 750ml wine bottles). Ditto for the “superb owls” Hooters is an infamous chain of fast food restaurants.

    I enjoyed this much more than his previous ones, perhaps because I am getting used to his style and accept that there will be Americanisms?

    Thanks Yank and Andrew.

21. Very tough, I struggled with this puzzle but was also rather distracted today.

    I did not parse 21ac apart from gin*+ E – but now I see it should have been ED not just E (thanks, Russthree@1); 4d; 14d; and the BOWL = hooter bit of 13d – I had mistakenly assumed SUPER = great – haha, that’s a good clue!

    New for me: FINK = rat; Rover = a setter (for 26ac).

22. Tim C@19, thanks.

23. Americanisms in a crossword by Yank – who’d a thunk it?

    Really enjoyed this with podium places for CONCERT GRAND, ASBESTOS & SUPER BOWLS

    Cheers A&Y

24. I mostly liked this. There were quite a few I entered unparsed, and I admit I only half-parsed ICE SCUPTURES (could see it was an anagram, didn’t bother going into every detail); the others did come clear in the end, though I did spend a short time wondering how a CONCERT GRAND could be defined as a squeeze-box. I’ve seen SUPERB OWLs used thus before so that was a write-in after realising which type of hooter was meant.

    Liked ALTERNATES – really the players are alternatives, but I did know the usage, and of course there’s an expected US influence on the clues. Other favourites FORGET IT, ANTIGONE, NAKED EYE. Less keen on LATTES and WHERE whose definitions I thought vague.

    Thanks Yank and Andrew.

25. I enjoyed most of this, especially EDISON for the light-bulb moment, the word play in CONTINGENT and the neatness of ALTERNATES.
    Thanks to Yank and Andrew

26. Martin @6 Shouldn’t that be (3,3,5)?

27. I’m not sure if it started as an autocorrect, a typo, or a bit of cleverness, but superb owl [sic] is in regular use in the comments below guardian NFL posts, which helped here.

    @Martin – should your scat clue numbering be (3,3,5)?

    Thanks for the transatlantic blog and puzzle.

28. I was convinced BINGE DRINKER had to be KNIFE GRINDER but couldn’t make it parse, but then I couldn’t parse the right answer, either. Wynsum@25 Nice one!

29. There is a minor typo in your blog Andrew. In SEED PEARL, the L should also be highlighted in RL (right and left).

    A tricky solve but worthwhile, and it is good to occasionally get a transatlantic feel to a puzzle, even if it did involve expressions unknown to me, such as THREE POINTERS.

    Thanks Andrew and Yank

30. Had to give up on this one, was not on Yank’s wavelength at all today. What I could solve I liked, but looking through the blog post there’s a lot I feel I never would have figured out in a million years!

31. 26 across. So, Rover was the moniker of a crossword setter was he? Who’d’ve known it? Just a small circle.

32. Yes Hornbeam @26 and Philinch @27 I messed that up. Trying to wrangle my son on holiday. Thanks for looking anyway.

33. I had no idea what was going on with THREE POINTERS and had to reveal it, then couldn’t understand the result. I started doing the cryptic a little after 2010 so I thought the Rover clue pretty obscure. Are ragas featured in Bollywood soundtracks? I think of them as Indian classical music but am open to correction. I liked CONCERT GRAND, TRA-LA and ASBESTOS but I wonder if anyone has ever used ‘brinker’ as a noun (not a trade or placename) other than in a crossword.

34. I recall the first time I went to the USA on business. My boss warned me that I might think I know about America but it’s still a foreign country.
    Thanks both.

35. 2d) held up the proceedings until the other Joplin came to mind. Conjoined by yet more americanisms, BAHH! Thankee kindly Y’all!

36. There were a few unknowns for me, including THREE POINTERS and ALTERNATES (in the sense of substitutes). I was a bit puzzled about WHERE, but on reflection I suppose it refers to the fact that some invitations can be in the format of “what / when / where”.

    Martin @6, I think 18a could have said either “former wife” or “former husband”, but the latter might have made for a rather darker surface.

    (There was a great episode of “What We Do In The Shadows” when the vampires are invited to what they think is a superb owl party — I seem to remember PostMark mentioning it on a previous occasion.)

    Thanks Yank and Andrew.

37. Liked UFOS, B DRINKER, ICE SCULPTURES, CONTINGENT and NAKED EYE.

    Thanks Yank and Andrew.

38. Huge thanks to the Guardian crossword editor for the first puzzle with any chew in two weeks; nice, and efficacious, to face the demand for a little mental heft (my No 2 reason for doing these things, after enjoyment!)
    I thought BART was marvellous – exactly the sort of clue to get a 10 year old hooked (just as I was in a previous millennium)
    Yup – I really enjoyed the solve…
    Many thanks to Andrew and a big ‘Gee thanks’ to Yank for the entertainment

39. I didn’t know ALTERNATES in that sense was an Americanism, just popped it in.

    Does “slice” really = “knife”? I think of knifing someone as more of a stabbing motion. I’d never have parsed ASBESTOS — too far-fetched for me.

    I don’t remember ROVER either.

    Andrew — you have a typo in the blog for 16ac, AFTER for ALTER.

    People complain about rhotic/non-rhotic homophones, but I’ve never seen a complaint about w/wh ones. “Wear” is not a homophone of “where,” “witch” doesn’t sound the same as “which”, “wail” isn’t the same as “whale.” Does no one care?

    Thanks, Yank and Andrew.

40. Valentine @39 – most of the English-speaking world has the wine-whine merger, so I’m not sure this can reasonably be seen as a problem.

    Thanks, Yank. Thank.

41. Valentine@39l w/wh words have come up before here.. Not in my dialect, but I hear you.

42. I knew, with absolute certainty, that I would come here and find both (a) people who didn’t know what a THREE POINTER was, and (b) some kvetching about some American usage that I didn’t even know was American. I’d say “sub” rather than alternate for a bench-warmer usually, too, but I have heard the latter. [But so should have you: in tennis, which you follow in the UK too, the top ten players at the end of the year go to the tour finals tournament, even though only eight play; nos. 9 and 10 are designated first and second alternate, and sub in if one of the top eight withdraw before the end of the round-robin phase.]

    I also figured, apparently correctly, that “first-string” would be American. (The first-string players are a team’s best; the second string are the ones they use when the first-string players are injured or ineffective, and the third-stringers are the ones they use when desperation strikes. No sport, not even American football, has rosters large enough to have fourth-stringers.)

    Anyway, re THREE POINTERS, I’d say a basic element of the game of basketball is fair turnabout for all the years of cricket minutiae.

43. It’s bad enough having US stuff in Wordle, but I don’t like them in a Guardian crossword. And “invitation word” as a definition for WHERE? But I’m glad some of the commenters enjoyed it.

44. mrpenney@42. I’ve been looking forward to you chiming in and getting your own back for all the cricket references in British crosswords.

45. Well I don’t know how I did it, but I did. I couldn’t parse everything (ALTERNATES), and some were just guesses (LATTE, SETTER), but everything was correct! I almost gave up, but it very gradually gave way — very satisfying. A lot of favourites, 1a FORGE TIT, 2d RAGA (for the double musical references), 3d EDISON, 6d ANTIGONE, 13d SUPERB OWLS (even though probably done before), and more

    Nice to have all the Jays around! 🙂

46. Antipodeans are exposed to both British and North American kulcha. Half the fun for me is being open to the probabilty that there will be unfamiliar references, taking me somewhere I haven’t been before.
    But I can understand copland@43 that’s not what you’re looking for in a. British/Guardian crossword.

47. paddymelon@41
    WHERE
    British
    Chambers gives the pronunciation of where as (h)wār (Valentine must be pronouncing the word like this, I guess).
    However, some other dictionaries give the pronunciation the same as that of ‘wear’. Maybe some people don’t have
    any trace of ‘h’ in their ‘where’?!
    American
    M-W says (h)wər

48. Like Valentine@39, I didn’t know some of these were Americanisms. Alternates vs. alternatives has been kicked around here a few times but I didn’t know first-string was American; I remember the Bagthorpes talking about having more than one String to your Bow but I guess that did not transfer to first-string.

    Couldn’t parse CONTINGENT (was trying to work out something with COGENT + IT + two Ns for Newtons as force) or BINGE DRINKER. Also didn’t get WEED (“wee” as a verb is decidedly not an Americanism but I’ve seen it here a bunch).

    Thanks to Yank and Andrew!

49. Loved many of these. THREE POINTERS, SUPER BOWL, and the incongruity between TEA PARTIES and PIRATES ATE!

    Very nice and thanks Andrew

50. matt w @48
    It’s not so much alternates/alternatives. Alternates over here would be called reserves, or substitutes perhaps.
    Second string is a familiar British expression; first string less so, but I have heard it.

51. I usually do the FT during the week, but decided to give Guardian a try today. I am afraid I am aligned with muffin@11 in not enjoying this much.

    I did like: STAND ASIDE and NEGLIGENT. On the other hand, more than one clue is in the running for the prestigious worst clue of the year award

    Thanks Yank and Andrew

52. Slow going. Needed the blog for four parsings (CONTINGENT, SETTER, LATTE, WHERE) – so am grateful as always to bloggers.

    SUPERB OWLS was very nice indeed

53. Too hard for me.
    Agree with Dynamite@30: good clues, but there are several I’d never have solved, however long I tried 🤔😊.

54. Re: Rover

    Perhaps not surprising that many here have not come across him – as Andrew says, he died in 2010 and his final puzzle for the Guardian was published posthumously on 20th January 2011.

    His debut was on 23rd December 1993 and over his career he contributed 138 puzzles for the Guardian. His most notable moment in the crossword world was arguably when he happened to be the setter of the first ever Guardian crossword to be published online – no. 21,620 on June 24th 1999.

55. Forgot to mention that The Atlantic (America’s third-oldest magazine, now more successful online than in print) annually runs on Super Bowl Sunday a selection of superb owl photos.

56. All the commenters who have complained about”alternates” have clearly forgotten the poker scene in “The Sting”. When Paul Newman first offers the train guard money the latter replies “I’ll make you first alternate, sir”. Then when Newman gives him more money the guard says”I’ll see what I can do.” The whole scene is outstanding.

57. Chickpea @56
    Not sure what point you are making. It’s an American usage, surely – the film is set in America. The complaints have been that the term isn’t used in that sense over here.

58. Spent a long time on SUPERBOWLS, until I realised had seen the exact same joke here in the excellecnt What We Do in the Shadows highly recommended: https://youtube.com/shorts/4VY1tD5-1M8?si=oA_A3CWcPHwMoe1b

59. Thanks Yank. This was slow going (dinner & breakfast) but I only missed WEED as well as a few parsings. I liked many of the clues including FORGET IT, UFOS, ALTERNATES, EDISON, TEA PARTIES, and NAKED EYE. Thanks Andrew for the blog.

60. First post here.

    Really enjoyed today. Loved the USA references.

    Pleased that I got 26ac straight out of the blocks, but shocked that “Rover” passed away in 2010. Only seems yesterday that I was taking on their grids.

61. THREE-POINTERS my favorite today for two reasons. First, the Denver Nuggets, with their lights-out shooters, play just down the road. And in 1954, as a 5-year-old, I viewed the Wise Monkeys at the Tōshō-gū shrine in Nikkō, my dad being stationed at a nearby Air Force base. Since then I’ve spoken no evil☺ Thanks Yank and Andrew.

62. Well, I had to have a chuckle at EXTRACTION – been to the dentist today and learned that a wisdom tooth’s got to come out – at my age! 🙁 (will this make me less ‘wise’?). At least the dreaded op won’t happen till October, dentist can’t fit me in earlier…

    Tough in places, a sort of curate’s egg of a puzzle, I guess the Americanisms didn’t help (is it correct that a score in basketball is called a ‘basket’? had to guess at that one and that you get three points for it) And LATTE to me merely suggests a sort of coffee with too much milk in it – yuck (I guess the French would call it café imbuvable)

    I have to admit I don’t recall the SETTER ‘Rover’, clearly before my time (at least, as a cruciverbalist). Shame really.

    And I tried putting in IPHIGENIA at 6d (despite it being too long! – I left out the second I). Trouble is, for my sins I did (ancient) Greek O-level, for which we had to study both Sophocles (writer of ANTIGONE) and Euripides (who wrote Iphigenia in Aulis etc.). Easy to get them mixed up. But then I realised the wp and word length only work with ANTIGONE.

    Rest was fine though some of the clues rather on the easy side (e.g. BART, TEMPLE). Liked BINGE DRINKER, CONCERT GRAND, FORGET IT; WEED; ASBESTOS; CONTINGENT.

    Thanks to Yank and Andrew.

63. LOL, for all those complaining about the basketball reference, at least the sport is actively played in Europe. Imagine if it was a baseball reference.

64. I used BRINK (‘edge’), ING (‘rotten gin’), E (‘fifth of mullEd’) and RED (‘wine’), then made them ‘fanciful.’ Seemed to fit pretty well.

65. Laccaria @62, a field goal (or, informally, a basket) in basketball is worth three points if the person shooting it is farther from the basket than the three-point line; two points otherwise. That’s why the clue defined THREE POINTER as “long basket”. There’s also what’s called a free throw, awarded in the event of a foul; those are uncontested baskets (shot from the free-throw line, duh) and are worth one point.

66. Just to complicate matters a little more, in this year’s WNBA all star game there was a four point line, where shots from beyond it counted for four points. This was a test to see if fans liked the idea. My sense is that it was not popular and will probably not be incorporated into future games.

67. Bardy of the Marsh @60, welcome to the forum!

68. Please could the various jays (lower case or otherwise) differentiate their handles.

    Thank you

69. First-string an A for this cellist. Thank you Yank and Andrew

70. I remember when Mark became PostMark after another Mark showed up!

71. Simon@68 and Mig@70, this was already discussed here. See Eileen@45 followed by the exchange @57-59.

72. Apologies Jay, I didn’t mean to imply that you should change your moniker — you certainly have seniority!

73. 3d it was screwing around got me there’ Lightbulb ‘60wES” Edison Screw

74. My overall take was similar to Andrew’s. Grateful for the parsing of 21a BINGE DRINKER. Struggled to find SUPER BOWL, partly because in my head it was (wrongly, I now know) one word. Failed to parse 27a ASBESTOS: I didn’t even know Arsenic was an element, let alone its symbol! I didn’t know Rover (doggone it!). Not sure how many Bollywood soundtracks actually feature RAGAs, but the intention was clear enough. Like Valentine @39, I think “slice” to define “KNIFE” is a bit loose—but no more than that. Also, too: how is the last “E” the bottom of “NEGLIGÉ(E)” in an across clue (9a)?

    I liked 5a LATTES, 16a ALTERNATES, 1d FINK (despite the above), 13d SUPER BOWLS, and 23d ALPS (had to think to find the right “chains”). Here in OZ we have lots of Superb birds, such as the Superb Lyrebird, the Superb Parrott, the Superb Fairy Wren—but no SUPERB OWL. We have to make do with the Powerful Owl.

    POSSESSIVENESS:

    My inner Ximenean doesn’t approve of “EX” being clued by “former wife’s”, not because EX can also mean former husband/girlfriend/boyfriend &c, but because it requires us to ignore the “apostrpohe-s”, which cannot be made to work in the clue. Available alternatives include “former wife takes hold” or “… gets a grip”.

    Going the other way, how does “Wise monkeys number” clue “THREE” without an apostrophe after “monkeys”?

75. Someone has no doubt said this, but 21 across is an anagram of ‘gin’ + ‘Ed’ inside ‘brinker’.

76. Bill@75, Yes, Russthree@1, Jay@4, Geoff Down Under@7, and others. Instead of “fifth” referring to the fifth letter, it seems to mean one fifth (approximately) of the word “mulled”, which is a very inaccurate fraction — it’s really one third. I wonder if it’s an error by the setter?

77. Belatedly, RIP Rover, but I thought this was a reference to occasions where setter means a traveller or rover – as in Jet-setter, or out-setter?

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