Independent 12,193 by Bluth

12 comments on “Independent 12,193 by Bluth”

1. If you Google ‘misfit team manager’ a hit comes up with the idea that it’s a trope in narrative storytelling for certain specialised groups. I haven’t investigated fully thru lack of interest. The clue was clever enough with back as the reversal indicator in his G puzzle today as well. I had to cheat for REPAIRERS because I couldn’t twig the def and I was pressed for time. Enjoyed NAIL CLIPPERS and the other long entries which Bluth always has in his puzzles and which he does well. Thanks for the blog and the puzzle.

2. I guessed that TROPE was referring in some way to Ted Lasso but still a bit vague as a definition. Wordplay clear enough though.

3. 22d is a bit strange. Why pick Hergé? It ends in an e aigu not a plain e so the answer doesn’t follow.

4. There was loads to like here, and I made swift progress – albeit with the Perrier one holding out for a long time and consequently most of the down clues which stemmed from it – and so I remained optimistic right up to the last two which were responsible for my DNF: the intersecting BIPLANE and REPAIRERS. I don’t think “buy” for “pay for” would ever have come to mind (although I can’t quibble with it); but had “purchase” been used instead of “pay for” then I’m pretty sure I’d have got it. Once I’d revealed that one, I did get REPAIRERS but misunderstood the def and hence failed on some of the parsing; I assumed that re-pairers – those who get together a second time – must “make [a] good couple”! Retrospectively I do love “they make good” as the definition, though… so either way I can forgive being asked to look for a random TV show.

   To top it off, there were a couple I couldn’t parse: TROPE, which was a bung until I noticed that the wordplay worked, but even then I couldn’t for the life of me figure out what the definition was talking about (and I’m still none the wiser after reading the comments). And REFUSE COLLECTOR (too clever!). I was pleased to get the TONSORIAL jorum from only two of the inner checkers though. I agree with Banksia@3 about the strange choice for EBONY.

   Faves were END, LOADED, WOODPECKER and ICE-CREAM CONE, among plenty of other goodies.

   Thanks both

5. Thanks all.

   Re TROPE, I’m using the modern sense of the word – as given in Cambridge dictionary as “something such as an idea, phrase, or image that is often used in a particular artist’s work, in a particular type of art, in the media, etc.”

   The hard-bitten, alcoholic cop is a trope because we’ve all seen it in dozens of shows. The Chief of Police demanding his subordinate’s badge because he’s gone too far this time. That’s another. Evil Stepmother. The geeky scientist who takes off her glasses and shakes out her hair and unbuttons her labcoat and is suddenly seen as a beauty. The American high-school jock who’s a bully. The evil scientist. The moment someone pulls the trigger and we hear the click of an empty barrel. The moment a detective explains to the assembled suspects quite how he worked out whodunnit – these are all examples of characters or plot-points we’ve all encountered in dozens of shows, movies, cartoons, books etc – and are now tropes.

   Of course, when you don’t like the thing you’re watching, it’s a cliche or a stereotype – but what would a Miss Marple be without the “I’ve asked you all here tonight… ” moment?

   So while Ted Lasso is one example of the trope I used for my definition-by-example, I wouldn’t say it was a specific reference to Ted Lasso. Indeed, if there was only one example, I don’t think it could be a trope. But there are, of course, loads of examples… and whether you recognise any of these in particular is sort of irrelevant… I think we all recognise the overall shape of a story where, say, a busted-up drunk who’s been bounced out of the major leagues somehow winds up having to coach a bunch of inept schoolkids… and amazingly, he finds himself and they go on to some unlikely success.

   Walter Matthau in The Bad News Bears, Emilio Estevez in The Mighty Ducks, Goldie Hawn in Wildcats, Vince Vaughan in Dodgeball, Rodney Dangerfield in Ladybugs, Steve Guttenberg in Home Team, Rhea Perlman in Sunset Park, John Candy in Cool Runnings, Snoop Dogg in The Underdoggs, Whoopi Goldberg in Eddie etc etc etc and yes, of course, Ted Lasso.

   AP @4 – I think you’ve misunderstood the definition in REPAIRERS.
   The definition bit is simply: They make good.

   Make good = to repair

   Thanks to Quirister for the blog.

   Cheers!

6. Bluth@5, thanks for dropping in and giving us plenty of background! I definitely would think of most of the ideas you described as being tropes, and perhaps the most obvious ones such as evil stepmother and high-school jock and bully might have been enough for me to say, after guessing TROPE, “ah right, I get it!”. I must admit, though, that “Misfit team manager” was a bit to vague and insufficiently stereotypicial for me… I did indeed guess the solution but was mystified when I tried to make sense of what had to be the definition. Like others, I wondered whether it referred to a specific e.g. football manager who’s been in the news recently; but given that I don’t really follow sport regularly and even less read the news about it, I was unlikely to get it unless it was front-page news.

   Re REPAIRERS, indeed I did misunderstand it when I wrote it in – I assumed it was supposed to be interpreted as RE-PAIRERS (those who pair again) – but, as I was trying to say in my comment, upon reading the correct interpretation (and the correct definition) in the blog, I was impressed by it!

7. No problem with the definition of TROPE for me – Ted Lasso, Vince Vaughn in Dodgeball and John Candy in Cool Runnings were the examples that sprang instantly to mind for me, but there are loads of others…

   Great puzzle as ever, thanks, Bluth!

8. Thanks both. Quite a tussle for reasons already aired. I am still unsure about the role of ‘seeking’ in INSIGHT, but suspecting I had the right answer assisted with DIDGERIDOO. The very fact that our setter has offered a paragraphs-long explanation for the definition of TROPE suggests its difficulty.

9. Thanks to Bluth for the challenge, and to Quirister for the help I needed with several parsings. There’s a really fascinating website, TV Tropes, which has the instance here under the label Save Our Team, and with several of the films Bluth mentions cited in the “Examples” section. (Apologies for the advertising clutter.)

10. You wait ages for a DG puzzle then 2 come at once. How we are spoilt today!
    Managed to get 1A and 1 D quickly which helped, but must admit to joining the ranks of the flummoxed for TROPE.
    Otherwise great fun as always.
    Thanks setter & blogger.

11. TFO @8 in fairness, it was only a 1 paragraph explanation just several paragraphs of examples because it’s fun to write about!

12. I struggled with this. Some clues were great and some had too many levels of indirection.

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