Guardian Cryptic 27,199 by Brendan

by

Enjoyed this immensely…

…especially the varied uses of the thematic ‘initially’/’finally’ and similar, which all link in to 17/19/20 in the middle of the grid. Got stuck several times, and still can’t parse 23dn. Favourites among many were the 21ac/4dn pair, 3dn and 19dn. Thanks Brendan, for a delightfully crafted puzzle

Across
9 ORIGINATE One soldier, initially, aboard fancy launch (9)
I=”One”, plus GI=”soldier, initially”; all inside ORNATE=”fancy”
10 DELTA Kind of wings Daedalus had initially (5)
=a triangular aircraft wing shaped like a delta [?] [wiki].
The “initial” first letter of ‘Daedalus’ in Greek would have been a DELTA.
11 ATLAS Finally cut world record? (5)
a “record” of the maps of the world.
AT LAS[T]=”Finally”, with the last letter “cut” off
12 ITERATION Article finally reduced, helping to make new version (9)
ITE[M]=”Article” with its final letter removed, plus RATION=”helping”
13 END NOTE What’s finally written need not change (7)
(need not)*
14 DEEJAYS Players of music initially assembled? (7)
the phonetic representation of an acronym [DJs], hence “initially assembled?”
17, 19, 20 ALPHA AND OMEGA  Characters in old script from beginning also finish (5,3,5)
=the first and last letters of the Greek alphabet; =figuratively, the beginning and the end
19   See 17
20   See 17
21 SETTLER Line crossed by me, not an inhabitant initially (7)
L[ine] inside SETTER=”me”
22 BOOKLET Very well packing trunk, finally fit in small volume (7)
OK=”Very well”, inside BOLE=”trunk” of a tree, plus the final letter of [fi]T
24 SHILLINGS Informs about rise in cash used in 1971, finally (9)
=currency used in the UK until 1971.
SINGS=”Informs” [=confesses to the police]; around HILL=”rise”
26 INANE Stupid way clue and puzzle finish (5)
the words ‘clue‘ and ‘puzzle‘ finish IN AN E
28 LASER Scientific device initially put together in 1960 (5)
=a device originally created in 1960, and an acronym hence “initially put together”
29 MINIATURE Initially reduced a lot in adult? Very little (9)
INI[tially] reduced by a lot of letters; inside MATURE=”adult”
Down
1 CODA Ace holding up fish that gets played, finally (4)
=the end to a piece of music
A[ce] underneath COD=”fish”
2 FILLED Ignoring negative split, finally editor is satisfied (6)
FI[na]LL[y] ignoring ‘nay‘=’negative’ split into two parts; plus ED[itor]
3 FIRST OF ALL Trees to come down, initially (5,2,3)
FIRS TO FALL=”Trees to come down”
4 NATIVE Inhabitant initially unsophisticated about time (6)
NAIVE=”unsophisticated” around T[ime]
5 DEFENDED Part of OED finished and justified (8)
DEF[inition]=Part of Oxford English Dictionary; plus ENDED=”finished”
6 IDEA Initially, is doctor elated at result of brain operation? (4)
Initial letters of I[s] D[octor] E[lated] A[t]
7 ULTIMATE Final university tardy covering MIT up (8)
U[niversity] plus LATE=”tardy” around MIT reversed/”up”
8 MAIN Leading part in drama, initially (4)
hidden in [dra]MA IN[itially]
13 EXAMS Tests officer, initially, with fire directed upwards (5)
S[ergeant] M[ajor]=”officer, initially”, plus AXE=”fire”=dismiss employee; all reversed/”directed upwards”
15 ECONOMICAL Saving money with false claim on author, initially (10)
(claim on)*, with [Umberto] ECO=”author” placed in front of the other letters or “initially”
16 START Initiate top player on time (5)
STAR=”top player” on T[ime]
18 POTTIEST Start off initially in drug trial with least sense (8)
the starting letter of I[nitially], inside POT=”drug” and TEST=”trial”
19 ACRONYMS Words initially put together in a piece of writing about friend (8)
A MS=a manuscript=”a piece of writing”; around CRONY=”friend”
22 BASING Initially establishing container, finally good (6)
BASIN=”container” with G[ood] at the end/”finally”
23 LEAGUE Distance definable, for me, as initially in four pieces (6)
 Edit, huge credit to robert in the comments: “initially” in four pieces gives ‘in / it / I / ally’, which is a definition of a LEAGUE from the point of view of one person i.e. “for me”
24 SALT Preserve discussions to reduce nuclear danger, initially (4)
=to preserve e.g. meat using salt.
also [wiki] an acronym for Strategic Arms Limitations Talks during the Cold War
25 LYRE Old instrument some finally retuned (4)
Hidden in [final]LY RE[tuned]
27 EDEN Place for couple, initially, in gated enclave (4)
Hidden in [gat]ED EN[clave]

73 comments on “Guardian Cryptic 27,199 by Brendan”

  1. Great crossword. I wondered about DEF in 5d as referring to 3 consecutive letters? I’ve spent ages trying to parse 23d, but have also failed so far. Probably kick myself when all is revealed.

  3. Thanks, manehi.

    A tough challenge but, as you say, a most enjoyable one.

    I’m afraid I can’t parse 23dn, either.

    Some really super clues – too many to pick out favourites.

    Many thanks to Brendan.

  4. thanks to Manehi
    Amazing puzzle.
    23d – football, if the pieces were divisions? not at all convincing
    Otherwise, I’m looking at ‘me’ and/or ‘as’ as initials. me for middle east?

  6. James @4

    I also wondered if it was a sporting reference but was thinking of GAA and the 4 provinces?

  7. Excellent crossword and well-blogged, thanks! I needed help parsing 2d and have no idea on 23d unfortunately.

  8. I could not parse 2d or 23d and incorrectly parsed 10a as DELTA Airlines.

    My favourites were ACRONYMS & FIRST OF ALL

    Thanks Brendan and manehi.

  9. As one of those who has in the past had the occasional moan at the over-use, in cluing, of initially and finally and ultimately, I found this disarmingly bold and witty – altogether a pleasure. Maybe Brendan will tell us about 23d. The four divisions of the Football League seemed the least worst of the suggestions so far (but that was not an ‘initial’ set-up).

  10. Another stab at 23d. In four pieces of answers we see AL. In alpha, salt, first of all, economical and AL can stand for American League. Ok, a bit of a stretch.

  11. Wonderful puzzle, but hard work. I loved the inventive cluing. Favourites were DEEJAYS, ATLAS, ECONOMICAL and SHILLINGS. I also can’t parse LEAGUE. Many thanks to Brendan and manehi.

  12. 23d – is this something [a bit awkwardly] around “out of my…(definable, for me)… league”, being four words meaning “distance”?

  13. Thanks both. Great puzzle
    Re 23d – maybe the “initially” refers to the fact that the Football League used to be four divisions, but now is Premiership, Championship and 2 divisions. Still makes 4 though

  14. Thanks Brendan; nice idea.

    Thanks manehi; LEAGUE was my LOI. I wonder that as league is: ‘the distance a person could walk in an hour,’ this relates to [Brendan, me] being able to walk four miles in an hour?

    I liked ACRONYMS and INANE, although that has been done before e.g. Puck’s ‘Silly way battle ends.’

  15. I think manehi’s suggestion @5 of “IV” League is the most convincing so far, though there still seem to be some extraneous words in the clue.

    Lovely crossword, though.

  17. Thanks to Brendan for restoring my confidence in crossword solving, and to manehi for the blog.

    I found all the discussion re LEAGUE at 23d interesting, but everything that has been said so far still leaves me wondering about that one.

    Favourites were SETTLER 21a, FIRST OF ALL 3d, and CODA 1d, my LOI.

    I liked the two significant dates, 1971 for the change of currency leaving SHILLINGS behind (ours was the fourteenth of February 1966) and 1960 for the invention of LASER.

    I also appreciated the repetition of the “initially” idea, in all its different forms and applications within the puzzle.

  18. P.S. My crossword dictionary does have piece = division, so I think it probably does relate to the ‘initial’ four football (soccer) divisions as james@4 and shirl @13 intimated.

  19. Still pondering over 23d, all I can think of is that the LEAGUE used in Jules Verne’s “Twenty Thousand Leagues under the Sea” was four kilometres.

  20. I wonder if ‘pieces’ in the clue for 23d should read PACES. A distance of 4 paces makes more sense as a surface. Still can’t parse it, though!

  21. Brilliant puzzle. I’m tearing the remains of my hair out over 23d. Brendan, where are you to put me out of my misery?

  22. This puzzle infuriated me. I can’t believe I’m the first person to say anything negative. If there’s anyone else out there who gave up you are not alone. (And I can usually complete but never got anywhere near with this one). Seeing the answers gave me few lightbulb or dohhh moments. And the fact that no one can parse 23D (which I got but also couldn’t work out) says it all. Sorry to be negative but this is a message of solidarity for any fellow solvers who toiled in increasing dismay with this one. Ho hum.

  23. 23:

    mine = for me, a = as initially, (giving maine) surrounded by quarters (in four pieces) – quartermaines (league of extraordinary gentlemen), with a sort of extended definition by example.

  24. muffyword@23
    could be – though I think me as the abbreviation for maine is more straightforward

  25. Could the four pieces possibly refer to an hour, which has four quarters? An hour was the time it originally took one person to walk a league.

  26. James@24 – yes, and that means “in” isn’t doing double duty. He might one spelt Quatermaine, though, which spoils it a bit…

  27. Robi @18 and others: the four-division football league was far from beng the ‘initial’ set-up, and the use of initial/ly in this puzzle is too precise to make this a plausible key to the mystery.

  28. quenbarrow@28
    I agree – there are too many words unexplained. I’m sure the key is in the ‘me’

  29. manehi@27

    Yes, he is spelt Quatermain. There is a Quartermaine in General Hospital, but that doesn’t help. I fear my explanation is nonsense.

  31. There is the Captain Nemo of the submarine Nautilus, and Nemo the fish in the film “Finding Nemo”, apparently nemo means ‘nobody’ in Latin, but can see little relationship with the clue apart from ‘me’.

  32. A lovely treat from Brendan although I too am in the ‘could he please turn up and explain 23d’ club

    Thanks to him and Manehi too

  34. Not an explanation for 23d but perhaps a step in a diffferent direction: it occurred to me that someone with the pseudonym Brendan might define himself as an EU GAEL. How “as initially in four pieces” might indicate reading this up (i.e. backwards) is not clear.

  35. If LEAGUE were related to distance under/on the sea, there are four oceans (some people consider that there are five), Me = Maine, but there is no homophone indicator to give ‘main’…

  38. robert@36: Brilliant! ‘In it i ally’ in four pieces indeed. Go straight to the top of the class.

  41. I thought the whole crossword, apart from 2d FILLED, was brilliant. I have just seen robert’s explanation of 23d LEAGUE (which had left me mystified even though I ‘solved’ it), and that was possibly the most brilliant of all, as it was so hard to see, but it works.

    Many thanks to Brendan and manehi.

  43. I couldn’t parse LEAGUE either so well done robert! Pretty tough by Brendan’s standards but very entertaining. My last two were ATLAS and CODA – no excuses for not seeing those earlier

    Thanks to Brendan and manehi

  44. 23d: as per Julie but explainable as “four pieces” initially gives one “FP league” which refers to the Fantasy Premier league … which perhaps is a definition (definable) familiar to Brendan (me).

  45. Well done, Robert, and Brendan for the device. Simple, my a (initially). What a relief it’s plausible, and not a dubious blot on the puzzle. Now, what did I have to do today?

  46. I was ‘initially’ irritated by this puzzle, thinking I would get nowhere with it, but gradually it began to fall into place and, with a small amount of external help, I completed it, a rare event for me.

    My only quibble was with 17,19,20 – alpha and omega are still the first and last letters of the Greek alphabet, there’s no ‘old’ about it.

    Thanks to Brendan and manehi, and to robert for putting us all out of our 23d misery!

  47. Thanks to Brendan and manehi. I arrive today with the major problem resolved. I had trouble explaining DEEJAYS and LASER but much enjoyed the variations on “initially” etc. Neatly done.

  48. Thank you Brendan, manehi and Robert!

    Great fun. I got tied up at 29a, I tried to take ‘1 tally’, ‘a lot’, out of ‘initially’. Completely failed at parsing 23d, Brendan could do that trick with ‘initiate’.

    The clue of the day has to be that for LEAGUE.

  49. This was a very clever crossword with lots of misdirection through the use of “initially”. My personal favourites were FIRST OF All (which i may have seen before but which still made me smile) POTTIEST and ACRONYMS. Thanks go to Brenda, manehi and also robert (for putting a lot of us out of our misery!).

  51. Thanks Brendan and manehi

    I suspect that Brendan had more fun setting this than I did in solving it, as I don’t like puzzles that keep repeating a word in lots of clues. Having said that, this one turned out better than I was expecting when I first read it through.

    DELTA was my favourite.

  52. Thanks to Robert from me too. I don’t remember ever before writing a clue that gave so much trouble – it was not intentional. Indeed, I thought that 2 was more difficult. And thanks to Manehi.

    On 26th June (a certain anniversary) I will have puzzles in both the Times and the New York Times.

  53. I can see that this is a clever puzzle but, I think that Brendan enjoyed setting it rather more than I did solving it. I use “solving” in the loosest sense because some of my parsing was somewhat partial. LOI was ATLAS. I did like ITERATION.
    Thanks Brendan.

  55. Brendan @52. Weird, isn’t it? – I had no problem with 2dn! And 23 looks quite obvious now – the sign of a good clue, as people often say here, and this was a great one. Thanks again for a super puzzle.

  56. Remembering the theme would have helped me get a few of the answers more quickly. I did not parse LEAGUE, very clever, and thanks very much to Robert for explaining that one.

    At first all the initially mentions seemed irritating, but the puzzle is a lever diverse exploitation of the word, with possibly 23d being the most impressive

    Many thanks Brendan and manehi

  58. I have a different parsing for 23d – surely a lot simpler than the one above. For “pieces” substitute “divisions”, and then you have the old (pre-Premier) Football League.

  60. Well I never, I confess to being a little chuffed with myself when I eventually figured it out but feel quite undeserving of the plaudits.

    Thank you to everyone who has written such kind words here and BTL on the other site.

    Thanks especially to Brendan and manehi for the excellent puzzle and blog (and for giving me the opportunity to get lucky).

  61. Couldn’t parse 2 or 23 so thanks to manehi and robert!
    I got no further on 2 than ‘split’=’fillet’, so I was looking for the negative in the wrong place.
    Well done Brendan.

  62. I forgot to say that I thought that it was a little bit clumsy to have a solution to one clue the first word in the next one – unless it was deliberate? (16d/18d)

  63. I am still rather puzzled by 29a, I cannot believe Brendan’s cluing is so loose – did no-one else subtract “1 tally” from ‘initially’? Am I bananas?

  64. Cookie @63
    I think that “loose” is accurate. Brendan had painted himself into a corner by trying to fit “initially” or “finally” (or similar) into every clue – one of the reasons why these types of efforts aren’t my favourites.

  66. Cookie, you seem to disagree with me when I’m agreeing with you 🙂 There isn’t any indication that “I tally” is removed from “initially” not in that order – the letters to be removed are TIALLY.

  68. Cookie and muffin
    I think 29a MINIATURE must be as manehi parsed it, where ‘Initially’ is “reduced by a lot of letters.” Yes, it is a bit loose – no doubt a consequence of taking on such a big challenge, as has been said.
    In 2d FILLED the wordplay is strained rather than loose (in my opinion), but that also had to have ‘finally’ or ‘initially’ in it!
    Quite an accomplishment nevertheless.

  70. Pure class from my namesake!

    As opposed to the petty nitpicking and nonsense found in a lot of the comments on here.

    Thank you Brendan

  71. It’s not often that I fully agree with the previous speaker but this was indeed ‘pure class’.
    [and yesterday I did agree, too]
    Difficult for a Brendan, true, but what a fantastic way to deal with a theme.

    We were very impressed.
    Almost forgotten about the annoying fact that there were two hiddens in a row (25d, 27d).

    Wonderful!!

  72. People just find the ‘initially’ and ‘finally’ thing a little repetitive, I guess, BNTO, as I did. I’m still left feeling that whilst very clever, this was a little injurious to the spirit.

    Thanks to both.

  73. Waited until this morning to finish this one. Got them all but needed Robert to explain 23d. Thanks to everyone

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